Newlyn letter for historic CT arrears.

[Tony south]

On 23rd August 2012 I received a letter out of the blue, text of which I have copied below. It is an attempt to extort money from me by intimidation and actually expresses an intent to steal property from my house.

 

I received no contact such as normal demands for a payment before this letter.

 

I believe many people will be scared into paying this company because of their tactics and I think it unlikely that any part of any payment, thus obtained, would find its way to the council.

 

It has a ring of authenticity about it because it does refer to a possible genuine magistrates order from 15 years ago!

 

I did attend a magistrates court around that time. It was not really a proper hearing because my name was never mentioned in court and I was not given any opportunity to provide a defence. I talked to someone from the council about arranging payment after the event and have no idea if it was paid or not as I have no records going back that far.

 

The Limitations Act 1980 makes to illegal for anyone to pursue this debt because there has been no contact in over 6 years. No judge would therefore give an order to permit a bailiff to take property.

 

-- start of text of first letter --

newlyn plc, letter heading and footer

 

REMOVAL NOTICE

 

MAGISTRATES' LIABILITY ORDER DATED Sept 17, 1997

ARREARS OF: Council Tax Standard & DUE TO London Borough of Hounslow

TOTAL OUTSTANDING: £ (amount between £500 and £600 was written in pen)

 

I have today attended your premises with the intention of levying and removing your goods and chattels to the auction value of £ (nothing written)

 

I will be reattending and goods may be removed even in your absence.

 

If you wish to avoid this distressing course of action

TELEPHONE IMMEDIATELY

 

WE WILL RETURN 25AUG (written by hand)

-- end of letter --

 

Nobody came on 25th Aug.

 

I took the first letter to the police, they took a copy but the officer did not show much interest.

 

I believe others will be scared into paying. That is the reason I have posted this here.

 

I am also curious to know how large this problem is ? I believe that it will become a much larger [problem].

Edited September 3, 2012 by MARTIN3030

[MARTIN3030]

Welcome to the site.

Have you actually been in touch with the Council after getting this ?

[MARTIN3030]

The Limitation Act does not apply to Liability orders unfortunately.

The Court of Appeal in Bolsover District Council and another v Ashfield Nominees Ltd and others [2010] EWCA Civ 1129 held that there is no limitation period for enforcing a liability order for outstanding council tax.

[sillygirl1]

However to enforce a court order after such a long time they would need to go back and convince the court they had every chance of success at getting a result... and most judges would query why they did not take action when they had a far better chance of success.

 

I bet even the council don't have records that far back - but it is worth contacting the court to check that this has been paid, or check the RegistryTrust to see if there is anything outstanding.

 

By the way if the warrant is outstanding from 1997 then they CANNOT take goods from you without a further court order, the original warrant would have expired - limitation period or not.

[Tony south]

I forgot to mention I received a second letter today titled "NOTICE PRIOR TO REMOVAL OF GOODS" that is similar to the first one but has red bits.

 

I have phoned Hounslow council, they told me the address this relates to and the actual amount of outstanding which was significantly less than that stated on the letter.

 

I will only deal with the council directly about this and intend on sending a letter to the debt collector informing them so.

 

I will send copies of the threatening letters to the council and ask them to reconsider if they should be using this collector.

Edited September 3, 2012 by MARTIN3030

[MARTIN3030]

Tony,please be a little more cautious with your wording.

Naturally,you are upset about this,but the firm in question is licenced and contracted to undertake collection by the Courts and the LA.

Can you confirm that both letters have been sent through the post and not left after visits ?

[Tony south]

The first letter was put through my letterbox by hand. It was picked up by my lodger who is, quite rightly, scared by it.

The second letter was sent by post.

[MARTIN3030]

Ok

So is there any breakdown of whats been asked for ?

Also on the letter that was pushed through the door there should be a name -if you would like to give us this we can check to see that the person is properly certified.

Dont post the name here-click the report icon and send to the site team.

[Tony south]

Oddly enough, there is a name on it in big bold letters. Its quite a common looking name but no signature of course.

 

If my tenant leaves as a result of the threatening letter put through the door, which was not in an envelope, I will hold the debt collector fully liable for all rent lost as a result. I think that would be quite reasonable.