Philips Bailiffs - Distress Warrant HELP

[putanendtoitall]

Hi everyone,

 

Looking for a bit of help with our current dealings with Philips Bailiffs.

 

My partner had a fine for use of TV set without a license and we had difficulties paying this fine.

 

It has since been passed to Philips Bailiffs who are now dealing with the matter.

 

We received a letter from them dated 28th March headed "NOTICE OF DISTRESS WARRANT".

 

At this time the outstanding amount was £195.

 

We immediately made an offer of repayment to them @ £10 per week.

 

The first payment was due on 17/4/2012 but we failed to make this as we only realised after making the plan that they would charge us an extra £3 each time we made a payment by debit card.

 

As we failed to make the payment, they sent another letter out... This time it was delivered in person and the total amount was now upto £410.

 

Instead, we got back in touch with them and offered them £80 every 4 weeks, which we wouldn't mind paying the extra £3 each time.

 

They declined this offer and said the minimum they could accept, according to their client West Mercia Courts, was £29pw/£58fortnightly/£127pm.

 

They sent another bailiff out last week to hand deliver another letter (Balance still at £410), saying:

 

REMOVAL NOTICE

 

With this on the bottom:

Please Note: We may re-attend your premises with a locksmith to remove any seized goods (as in accordance with the law), even in your absence.

 

Now we have been doing a bit of reading up and have come across this site: dealingwithbailiffs[dot]co[dot]uk

 

On that site it states this:

 

 

Bailiffs send demands in the post adding hundreds of pounds in fees before making a visit – the defendant has no legal obligation to pay them. Section 76 of the Magistrates Courts Act 1980.

Bailiffs cannot lawfully interfere with the locks of your property, or threaten to have a locksmith do so, or take any goods in your absence:Khazanchi & Another v Faircharm Investments Ltd & Others [1998] EWCA Civ 471

 

 

What we would like to know is:

1) If we were to make payment for the original outstanding fine amount, could the bailiff fees be waivered/ignored?

2) If there was no-one at the property, or if my partner wasn't here, are they still able to gain entry to the property with a locksmith?

 

Upto now there has been no proof of this warrant, only what they have said in the letters (Which looks to be a template).

 

We have just put an offer in to make payments of: 1x £100, 2X £127 and a final £56 = £410.

 

We have dealt with them by email over the last couple of weeks and they way they are coming across, regardless of the amount we pay, if we don't agree to their payment plans then they will continue with the recovery process. (Even if we paid £400 of the £410 oweing!)

 

Could anyone give us any advice?

 

Thank you in advance!

[renegadeimp]

Seems the bailiff didnt perform an initial levy so he cant get a locksmith to break in. Plus it seems he's adding on unfair charges.

 

And he's saying a court wont allow him to go under an arbitrary number? Yea.... No.

[putanendtoitall]

I presume by an initial levy, you mean a sort of inventory list? Whereby they come inside the property and check what we have that they can take?

 

How would we go about disputing the charges? Whilst it hasn't increased after the last letter, it says it will increase if they have to come out again. Even though we have made an offer of repayment and they refused it!

 

What I can't understand is the outstanding fine was around £170, yet they say the courts won't accept any less than £127 per month (At least that's what Philips said in an email)...

[renegadeimp]

Usually they have to try and gain peaceful entry so they can perform a levy.

 

As for the courts not accepting less, thats prob a big lie on part of the bailiff. Contact the court yourself to confirm it.

 

Courts only normally order a repayment amount that YOU can afford. Even if that means 50p a month.

[putanendtoitall]

I've asked my partner to call the court first thing in the morning.

 

I've been doing a bit of reading up and I'm under the assumption that whilst the warrant is still active, we can not pay the court the original outstanding amount, is this correct?

[renegadeimp]

If its passed to a bailiff you have to deal with them. However in some circumstances the bailiff can pass it back or you can force them to pass it back, or in rarer ones, you can ask a court to take it back. Tho the latter rarely happens.

 

Hopefully someone with a lot more knowledge of bailiffs in general will step in. Meanwhile, have a good read of the bailiff forums so you know your rights.

[wonkeydonkey]

If the Bailiff is asking for repayments that you quite clearly cannot afford, then you can apply for a means tested hearing. If you are refused, the answer is to simply sit it out and wait for the bailiff to return the warrant to the Court, at that point you will receive notice to attend the Court and explain why you have failed to pay..........then you can tell them you haven't refused to pay and that you would be happy to pay if the Court would set the repayment at an affordable rate that is also sustainable to your cirumstances.

 

Meanwhile each week set aside the amount you think is affordable to you and when you eventually get the matter back before the Court you can offer the saved amount as a lump sum to show your intention to pay the fine is genuine.

 

I am not saying the bailiff will give in easily but at the end of the day ....they cannot get blood out of a stone and debtors prison was long since abolished so stop worrying and start saving!!!

 

WD

Edited June 13, 2012 by wonkeydonkey

[renegadeimp]

Yep. To add to wonkydonkey's comments, they cannot break in either. They would need to send the entire debt back to court and you'd be summoned as wonkey rightly said. The bailiff is trying to harass and threaten you into paying, and really you need to be making formal complaints to the relevant authorities.

[putanendtoitall]

Thank you very much for your comments.

 

According to the bailiff, its not themselves who are stipulating the repayment terms... it's the court?

 

Do we apply for a means tested hearing directly at the court or through the bailiff?

 

We did make an offer to pay, but this would of left us ridiculously short. And with 3 children and my partner 4 months pregnant its not justifiable!

 

I was under the impression that if they had a warrant, they could force entry into the property?

 

Knowing the can't legally enter the property has eased our worries a little now.

[renegadeimp]

You can ask them to send it back, but really they should send it back themselves before they start threats about breaking in.

 

How old are your children? Because you could be classed as vunerable and as such this debt should never have gone to a bailiff anyway.

[putanendtoitall]

Our children are aged 8, 3 & 2 years old.

[renegadeimp]

You're pretty much classed as a vunerable debtor then. I'll flag your thread for a site admin to look at. I'm not sure if everything i have written is accurate but the admins will be able to give advice.

[putanendtoitall]

Thank you very much renegadeimp, you're a star!

[ploddertom]

As it is a Magistrates Court Fine for what is a criminal offence then it does indeed allow entry to be forced to your home. However please do not panic as this is aimed at the more persistent offenders who treat this as a game. After you stopped paying did you ever receive a letter from the Court asking that you bring the account up to date?

 

PT

[putanendtoitall]

I've just been speaking to my partner about it.

She has told me that after she was summoned to court to give her side of the plea (Which we didn't attend), we heard nothing more about the debt until Philips got in touch with us.

She said that we didn't receive any letters from the court to tell us how much was due/how often to pay etc.

[renegadeimp]

Sounds like judgement by default.

[ploddertom]

I've just been speaking to my partner about it.

She has told me that after she was summoned to court to give her side of the plea (Which we didn't attend), we heard nothing more about the debt until Philips got in touch with us.

She said that we didn't receive any letters from the court to tell us how much was due/how often to pay etc.

 

Have you moved address since?

[ploddertom]

Sounds like judgement by default.

 

Not applicable as this is Magistrates & not County Court.

[renegadeimp]

Oh yea. Whoops . Minds on something different. Although the repayment terms the bailiff stated still need investigation

[putanendtoitall]

Yes we have moved address. We moved February this year. The offence ocurred at our previous address late last year.

[ploddertom]

Yes we have moved address. We moved February this year. The offence ocurred at our previous address late last year.

 

Ah, that explains it all then. All the correspondence has been sent to your old address. You should contact the Court as a matter of urgency explain you have moved and ask to swear a Statutory Declaration to that effect. This should then wind the fine back to the original sum nd get rid of the Bailiff and his charges. As far as I am aware you have 21 days from when you first knew of this to swear the SD. When you contact the Court you need the Court Manager or Fines Officer.

 

PT

[putanendtoitall]

When you say 21 days of when we first knew of this. Does that mean 21 days from now, as we have only just found out we can do this. Or 21 days from when we were first contacted by the bailiff?

 

Thank you very much for all of your help upto now, its been a godsend!

[wonkeydonkey]

Yep the Stat Dec is your answer as PT says...then you also get to agree a repayment plan WITH THE COURT and the bailiffs will no longer have need to be on the scene. Meanwhile pay little heed to the bailiff threats, forced entry is not as simple as the bailiff would try to have you believe so either way you have nothing to worry about. Your partner definately falls in the vulnerable category and you should advise the Court of her pregnancy asap and tell them they need to call the bailiff off until the Stat Dec is in place.

 

WD

[putanendtoitall]

My partner has just confirmed the dates of her contact with them.

 

She sent an email on 11th May with no reply, she then sent a 2nd email on the 18th May and they finally replied on the 1st June.

 

Below is the email from them refusing the offer of £80 per month...

 

Thank you for your email,

We have noted your account with the information you have provided. We are

unable to stop enforcement action on the offered amount of £80 per month .

We are able to offer an arrangement on your account, please see below

arrangement offers. The arrangements that we are offering are the minimum we

are able to set with in the strict guidelines provided by our client West

Mercia Magistrates Court .

£ 29 .00 per week

£ 58 .00 per Fortnight

£127 .00 per Month

Please advise if you would like any of the above arrangements that we have

offer. We must advise that we would require the first payment to be in our

office on 19/06/12, week from today. If you are unable to commit to any of the

above arrangements we at Philips must advise that you make voluntary payments

on your account but unfortunately we will be unable to hold any action on your

account and our action may continue, where a possible Bailiff may attend the

address we hold on your account and further fees may be added to your account.

[ploddertom]

From now. You said earlier that you did not attend Court, if that is the case then you may not have been able to mitigate the fine & the Magistrates not knowing your circumstances may have fined you the maximum - worth asking about in my opinion.

 

PT