Help with Bailiffs and ''magistrate officer'' needed plz!!

[brassnecked]

k7_xcx you should follow ploddertom's advice on this one as if by maladministration, the council have been actually enforcing against you for arrears from a previous occupant

they are on a very stick wicket, and that money that may have been overpaid is better being spent on your new baby than being in the councils black hole and wrongly in some bailiffs back pocket

 

Sort the immeidiate issue of the bailiffs, then as pt says go after the overpayments at your convenience.

[ploddertom]

If you have someone in your area driving round pretending to be someone he is not then I think I would involve the local constabulary. You appear to have the said gentlemans name - better still if you had his Reg No - therefore they have no excuse for not being able to stop said person and have a look through his vehicle.

 

PT

[k7_xcx]

*****THANK YOU EVERYONE!!*******

 

Thank you for all your help and advice, I have took this all on board and with help from a lovely lady at the national debt helpline I composed a letter of complaint to the bailiffs.....It was 14 pages long but compromised of copies of letters, reciepts etc.

 

I emailed it to the bailiffs and gave them a time to get back to me ( as advised by NDH) which you can probably gather they didnt! I also emailed it to the council and took a hard copy in and got a reciept for this..

As I didnt recieve a response from Bailiffs I have now forwarded the complaint to ENSAS & ACEA. Oh and also sent a message to the CONMAN who visted my home last night advising of all this and as I fall into the category of ''vunderable people'' He is mis construing his powers if he tries to contact me again.

 

I have told them I will pay any reasonable charges that I owe - which is £54.50 and not £296!!

Once this is settled I then plan to take the lot to the cleaners for the money I have over paid - I just want confirmation all round that i owe NOTHING!

 

If anyone thinks I can do something better or change something please let me know!...x

[wonkeydonkey]

WELL DONE k7 you have got the ball rolling...just a small point and that is the maximum fees the bailiff can charge (in statute) is £42.50 and you don't appear to even owe them that so stuff the bailiffs fees. Did National Debt Line also tell you the Council are responsible for the conduct of the bailiffs they use to collect CT? so you can take all actions against both Bailiff and Council jointly.

Again a big well done:whoo:, caggers will help steer your ship and you can do everything without the need of a solicitor and their fees, baby will need a very big piggy bank at least twice the size of the bailiffs pocket.

[k7_xcx]

I know WD...Im so pleased with myself! lol

 

The max thet can charge me is £42.50 for 2 visits and £12 flat rate for levy of my car...not the £296 they wanted originally.

 

I took a copy of the complaint to the council and personally handed it to them and got a reciept...It states in the complaint that the bailiff has mis construed his own powers and also the council's as he is representing them also. The NDh and yourselves gave me lots of laws to quote from and by god did I quote them!! Hopefully ive baffled them as much as they baffled me.

 

The bailiff himself is named in the complaint and also states that his is in breach of a certain law due to his actions and him pretending to be someone else!

[hallowitch]

WELL DONE and rightly so you should be pleased with yourself I'm with WD on this one

 

...just a small point and that is the maximum fees the bailiff can charge (in statute) is £42.50 and you don't appear to even owe them that so stuff the bailiffs fees.

[ploddertom]

I notice what you say and wouldn't expect too much back from ENSAS & ACEA, these are self funded bodies from the enforcement industry. As well as the complaint you have sent off to the Bailiff have you specifically asked for a breakdown of their charges. If not here is a sample you can use, adapt it as you see fit and send it by both email & hard copy in post sent Signed For:

 

"From:

My Name

My Address

 

To:

Acme Bailiff Co

Bailiff House

 

Ref: Account No: 123456

 

Dear Sir

 

With reference to the above account, Can you please provide me with a breakdown of the charges.

 

This includes:

a - the time & date of any Bailiff action that incurred a Fee.

b - the reason for the fee.

c - the name(s) of the Bailiff(s) that attended on each occasion a Fee was charged.

d - the name(s) of the Court(s) the Bailiff(s) was/were Certificated at.

e - the date of the Certification.

 

This is not a Subject Access Request under the Data Protection Act S7 1998 so does not incur a fee of £10. You are obliged to provide this information.

 

I require this information within 14 days.

 

Yours faithfully

 

Ripped off customer"

 

PT

[k7_xcx]

Thanks PT, I have been sending this letter since 5th Dec and had no response apart from that lovely visit from thr magistrate officer last night!

 

I have put copies of all these in with the 14 page complaint!!! I truly hope they waste plenty of time reading it as i have wasted so much time writng it!!

[night-watchman]

Great news, well done

Perhaps the forum should think about making badges for the members to hand to bailiffs .......... "YOU'VE BEEN CAG'D"

[hallowitch]

Great news, well done

Perhaps the forum should think about making badges for the members to hand to bailiffs .......... "YOU'VE BEEN CAG'D"

 

 

omg that is so funny i love it :rofl::rofl:

[k7_xcx]

I like it!! Im still furious how such ppl get awaywith their bullying tactics!! Im still in 2 minds to report him to the police.

I live alone sunday-fri as my partner is posted away with the army....I feel very secure!! NOT

[k7_xcx]

typical...no reponse fron Bailiffs or anyone else! Looks like I'll be paying the council a visit tomorrow!!

[brassnecked]

typical...no reponse fron Bailiffs or anyone else! Looks like I'll be paying the council a visit tomorrow!!

 

If you go to the council make sure you takeCOPIES of your evidence not originals. just in case they ask to see something and conveniently lose it.

 

You are in the right here, and if they have been messing up your council tax because of the previous occupant, they are really in the doggie doo imho good luck tomorrow.

[k7_xcx]

***UPDATE*** I have recieved a response from Bailiffs today -

 

They have lined out the dates they supposedly came to my property and the charges however they have stated on the date that I did speak to the bailiff that I wasnt home but they levied my car - costs incurred £44 levy fee, £24.50 FOR SCHEDULE HEAD 5 fee ( wotever this is!!) and £185.00 for attendance/van fee!!

What actually happened was 8.12 - i spoke to bailiff ( as far as I am concerned this was the first visit!) I questioned the debt and he rang the council who confirmed we had been paying so he left the property.

On 9.12.10 we went to the council and settled all outstanding debt to april 2011 at 11am, returned home, left again and returned at 4pm to a ''notice of seizure'on our car posted threw our door for us to sign and return

 

HOW IS THIS VALID?? I have until 26th Jan to get back to them and pay the £296 in fees that they want!!

[brassnecked]

***UPDATE*** I have recieved a response from Bailiffs today -

 

They have lined out the dates they supposedly came to my property and the charges however they have stated on the date that I did speak to the bailiff that I wasnt home but they levied my car - costs incurred £44 levy fee, £24.50 FOR SCHEDULE HEAD 5 fee ( wotever this is!!) and £185.00 for attendance/van fee!!

What actually happened was 8.12 - i spoke to bailiff ( as far as I am concerned this was the first visit!) I questioned the debt and he rang the council who confirmed we had been paying so he left the property.

On 9.12.10 we went to the council and settled all outstanding debt to april 2011 at 11am, returned home, left again and returned at 4pm to a ''notice of seizure'on our car posted threw our door for us to sign and return

 

HOW IS THIS VALID?? I have until 26th Jan to get back to them and pay the £296 in fees that they want!!

 

I would have thought that as there was no outstanding amount left the bailiff cam whistle for his fees, I hope you are going to go after the council for a refund of the previous occupants debt you have paid/

 

Others on here will be able to help you with that.

[ploddertom]

Contact the Council and confirm you owe £0. Bailiff cannot continue enforcement for his fees only, he must start a claim in the Small Claims Court - very few do this as they then have to swear their Fees are correct.

 

PT

[k7_xcx]

The council have advised me that i owe £296 in fees - unlawful fees may i add! Ive had another emailed response from bailiffs today advising i was aware of the situation and i must pay all fees within next 7 days or further action will be taken. Bear in mind there is no longer an outstanding debt - just their fees so i believe they can not use their 'bailiff powers' to enforce this, they have to go through small claims court....Is this correct?

 

Also the 'notice of seizure' was made on my car AFTER the debt was paid direct to the council...i know believe this is not valid...so they cant clamp my car..

 

They have told me that i shud of paid them direct and not gone threw the council so basically i havent took note of their actions so need to pay within the nxt 7 days!!!

 

At 6 months pregnant I really dont need this!!!!

[brassnecked]

The council have advised me that i owe £296 in fees - unlawful fees may i add! Ive had another emailed response from bailiffs today advising i was aware of the situation and i must pay all fees within next 7 days or further action will be taken. Bear in mind there is no longer an outstanding debt - just their fees so i believe they can not use their 'bailiff powers' to enforce this, they have to go through small claims court....Is this correct?

 

Also the 'notice of seizure' was made on my car AFTER the debt was paid direct to the council...i know believe this is not valid...so they cant clamp my car..

 

They have told me that i shud of paid them direct and not gone threw the council so basically i havent took note of their actions so need to pay within the nxt 7 days!!!

 

At 6 months pregnant I really dont need this!!!!

 

 

I think you need to escalate a complaint via the council CEO, Head of Revenues and your Councillor and MP, and as you are pregnant and in the later stages, you may well be classed as viulnerable. The experts will be able to point you in the right direction, as I think they owe you, according to your original post you paid off arrears from a previous occupant, monies that the council were not entitled to recover from you, and to cap it all they set the bailiffs on you for THEIR mistakes. This is gross maladministration, and if you have forked out (sorry fork-it) £2k or so of someone else's debt, you should owe the council at this stage a fat zero, (possibly they owe you) and the bailiffs should owe you at the least any fees paid to them returned.

[ploddertom]

I note all that has been said so far and in my opinion you can tell the Bailiffs to Off Sod and if they want their fees tell them to take yo to the Small Claims Court. The only thing to be wary of here is that if the Council have paid the £296 to the Bailiffs this will leave you still owing that amount in CT.

 

What would be interesting to see is the response from the Council to:

1 - How many Liability Orders there are - if this is for a number of years there should be more than 1

2 - What periods of time each one covers

3 - How much each one is for

4 - How much is outstanding on each one

5 - The dates they passed them to the Bailiff

 

It follows if there is a period of time before you moved in you have paid someone elses bill and should be reimbursed for this. I apologise if this info is here somewhere but I cannot see it.

 

PT

[ploddertom]

 

They have told me that i shud of paid them direct and not gone threw the council so basically i havent took note of their actions so need to pay within the nxt 7 days!!!

 

 

What a shame have you given them a pint to cry into.

 

PT

[hallowitch]

There are also 3 other good starting points with this

1 - your local Councillor

2 - your local MP - if not fiddling expenses

3 - the local press

 

IMO should be taken all the way

 

PT

 

100% agree with you plodder

 

It only become apparent we had been paying arrears when the bailiff knocked! we went to the CT office and they went threw all our payments...there was 2 accounts open orignally both in our names!

 

I would also subject access request the council where has all the paperwork been going you should have had several letters and a summons if the council have a liability order against you before the bailiff was involved

what bailiff company is this

[k7_xcx]

it is dukes....they are now refusing to deal with me...see the email below which i recieved...

 

 

As all matters have been dealt with I must now advise that failure to make payment in full of £296 to our office by Friday 28th January will result in further recovery action being taken whereby additional costs will be incurred and the possibility of goods being removed. I must also point out that we will not enter into any further correspondence into this matter.

 

Please bear in mind that this £296 is there unreasonable fees and thats all that is 'owing' as the debt was paid off!!

 

How can they refuse to speak to me but want their money....i believe that they can not take further action also as I am classed as 'vunerable' - being 6 months pregnant!!

[fork-it]

Bailiffs cannot carry out enforcement action just for their fees alone.

 

JBW Enforcement Ltd v City of Westminster [2009] EWHC 2697 (QB), the Judge, Mr Justice Jack said:

 

 

Thus the bailiff gets paid only through the process of execution: if he becomes entitled to charge fees, but does not continue with the execution process, he will not recover them and he cannot sue the debtor for them.

 

http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/QB/2009/2697.html

 

 

 

You probaly dont owe fees anyway. They usually just make them up. Do the maths.

 

See also http://www.dca.gov.uk/enforcement/agents02.htm#part10

 

If you need help from a professional body in dealing with bailiffs then Z2K might be able to help. http://www.z2k.org/supporting-vulnerable-households

[wonkeydonkey]

Hi K7

 

Ok hun lets take a deep breath and start at the begining,

 

Lets deal with the Council first: you have every reason to suspect maladministration of your account...they are not going to knock on your door and say oops sorry about this but we might owe you several hundred £££.

Ploddertom suggested contact the Council and ask:

1 - How many Liability Orders there were - if this is for a number of years there should be more than 1

2 - What periods of time each one covered

3 - How much each one was for

4 - How much was outstanding on each one

5 - The dates they were passed to the bailiff

 

I think the time has come to now write to the Council asking the same questions. If they do not reply you may have to send them an SAR along with a £10 fee. some Councils do not charge but unless you can find out otherwise best to send them the £10. Help is available to you here to get that letter drafted. They have 40 days to comply and while you wait you can move on to the bailiffs.

 

Send the letter I have drafted for you (below) by email and also a hard copy along with a cheque for £42.50 make sure you send it recorded delivery also make sure you send a copy to the Council for their records.

 

Dukes Bailffs

by email and Royal Mail

 

 

Dear Sir,

 

I thank you for your previous email of xxx January 2011.

 

Please find enclosed a cheque to the sum of £42.50 in respect of the fees allegedly owed to you for collection of Council Tax.

 

It can be seen I have satisfied the true amount owed to you and therefore, I agree there is indeed no need for either party to enter into further correspondence.

 

That you openly suggest you will seek to "possibly remove goods" and "apply additional costs" to this account can be seen to be a matter for discussion before a Judge in the County Court.

 

Meanwhile, I remind you and ask you, to mark prominently on your records that I am 6 months pregnant and my condition gives cause to my being considered as vunerable, should I encounter further visits from your "magistrates officer" I will not hesitate to proceed with litigation in that this will clearly be harassment.

 

Yours sincerely

[brassnecked]

As per wonkeydonkey write to the council, and email copies to the head of revenues, CEO of the council, your councillor and MP, and also add that they have been as per your first post enforcing the arrears of a previous occupant on yourself which is wrong and tantamount to fraud.