Why is no one claiming the contractual rate of interest???

[JonCris]

It is a mystery to me that no one seems to be interest in following this route.

To me it seems clear, straightforward and thoroughly ahievable.

 

Better than that, it is "fair and reasonable" to quote a much used bank phrase.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/18288-whats-your-time-worth.html#post142053

 

Couldn't agree more' As well as the charges accruing % all of my out of pocket costs will have contractual interest added

[JonCris]

How can you claim for something you've never had? All that I have claimed for are the charges that are shown on the statement I haven't incurred any (Compound Interest) charges on those charges so how can I claim for them? - I'm going nuts, would someone please tell me if I'm entitled to claim these charges and if so whether I should or do I best leave them alone?

Two prelim letters now sent and an LBA!

 

If you had charges you also had interest added at whatever your lenders unauthorised rate (could be as much as 34% pa compound) is & it's this which you are claiming.

 

If you have paid them then you are claiming the same amount of interest from them as they would charge you for THEIR Unauthorised borrowing & Its called Reciprocity of Contract

Ain't life grand

[JonCris]

For goodness sake!

 

It is correct. If you paid a penalty charge of £50 plus their unauthorised borrowing interest rate 3 years ago add compound interest over the whole 3 years equivilant to their unauthorised borrowing interest rate quid pro quo!

[JonCris]

Why can't we just say, you took my money I'm going to charge you what you would have charged me. Full stop?

You took £20 5 years ago so I'm going to charge you interest on money that is mine at the same rate?

 

That's precisley what you are doing COMPOUND!

[JonCris]

Its called reciprocity of contract....... quid pro quo

Whatever they can do to you you can do to them

[JonCris]

Ive spent a few hours toting up my sons charges and decided to try and work out manually the interest they charged on the charges.

 

He was charged a total of £470 since 2002

 

I worked out the interest to be £350

 

so its nearly doubled the claim

 

I know its a long job and probably a bit advanced for the average Excel user like myself but an old fashioned calculater , pen and paper did the trick and its worth it.

 

Happy days

 

You don't tot up the total charges THEN add interest, that comes later. You take each charge, when it was taken then calculate the daily contractual rate up until the day your calculating it (you can add daily interest beyond that date later)

 

I suggest if he had charges taken as far back as 2002 you have probably miscalculated

[JonCris]

Hageuk:

 

Great addition to add & seems just right.

 

kevinlufflum:

 

You need to check your card terms & conditions which should be on the back of your statement which will show their unauthorised borrowing lending rate which I strongly suspect is much more than 16.9%. Probably more like 25% anything upto 35%. As it is usually the highest rate quoted look for that & that's the one to go for

[JonCris]

Charge the present day interest & let them argue about it later but the probably won't as its too difficult for them to get their heads round. Also they have to turn up to court to defend their position that you might be claiming too much don't they!

[JonCris]

There is a dedicated thread to the Limitation Act & how some here consider that banks have negated their 6 year limitation rights by concealing their unlawful charges

[JonCris]

have just contacted citibank and apparently they do not charge a higher rate of interest for unauthorised borrowing!! what a nice bunch they seem..not

 

Pull the other one. I bet someone responds to counter that. Either that or citibank have been ripping off ALL of their costomers.

 

Have you got the small print

 

Just a thought. If we use todays increased contractual rate it allows for inflation

[JonCris]

I agree. Also if you haven't yet repaid the bank because you disputed the balance it is very important to reclaim THEIR rate as it will be included in the outstanding sum. The only difference is that if you haven't yet paid off the balance then you can only claim for the period they have been adding their rate

 

After your calculation it may be that their is suffcient left to pay that you can offset your claim against the outstanding balance. Or it may be a little bit of both offset plus refund

 

If you have settled the balance previously, part of your claim should consist of contractual rates (purchase) of interest as you WILL have ALREADY paid them.

 

Under those circumstances any judge would be hard pushed to suggest that the claimant was only entitled to a lower rate.

 

If you haven't yet paid the borrowing you are only claiming back what they have already added to you account.

 

Its important not to lose sight of the fact this compensation is not a windfall. It is either interest on monies you have already paid & have not had the use of since it was unlawfully taken or interest on monies which have been inflated & that are being demanded by the bank.

 

PS Cap 1 have responded to my s78 "we dont agree with the OFT & we have passed your account to a DCA".......Total disregard for s78 & as we all knew, the Commissioner. copies off to OFT post haste.

[JonCris]

Yes & their rates for unauthorised borrowing will be in their T&C's & as their deduction of monies from your account WAS unauthorised because being the result of unlawful penalty fees it was also unlawful. Therefore you can & should apply the SAME rate to what amounts to THEIR unauthorised borrowing & here's a twist your application of THEIR rate is lawful

[JonCris]

Well I'm definitely going for it so time will tell how they react to it. Check the link in my sig to keep up to date on whether they pay up or not. I did think I'd offer them their authorised rate as a gesture of goodwill untill I realised I have no feelings of goodwill towards them whatsoever. Annoying them as much as possible is far more satisfying, and nothing annoys banks like giving away their own money.

 

Correct but remember it's not THEIR money it's yours, it's mine, it's everyone else's on this & many other sites.

 

Also you don't have to show the interest just the amount claimed & why should you, the banks make their statements as confusing as possible to read so do the same. You can explain your calculations later to the court if required

[JonCris]

What appears on the website may not reflect what they are charging you. Hardly anyone gets the published rates these days. Most because of the perceived risk indicated by their credit rating pay a much higher rate than advertised. Check your statements both front & rear

[JonCris]

Thanks for the speedy replies.

 

Judging by what I find on the site I may well go for a resubmitted LBA because the differences are vast. £516 interest compared to £1820 interest. If I can get away with it I will try as it will extend the time frame.

 

One problem may be that the interest calculators show a rate of 8% when really the person filling the form in should insert their own interest rate according to their contract. It is misleading as just about everybody on this site will have an interest rate to insert as we are all dealing with accounts. (just a thought)

 

Hi sorry to be a pain but may I remind you your not getting away with anything.

 

They have probably not only added THEIR contractual rate to THEIR unlawfull bank charges & all your doing is not only recovering them but also charging THEM THEIR rate of interest for UNLAWFULLY borrowing YOUR money........."Quid pro Quo"

[JonCris]

Yes! Don't even sign "Full & Final" as you may find (much) later that there are other things you can claim for, the most obvious being defamation.

 

I would refuse any offer, full or otherwise, that had any conditions attached. In fact I would accept an unconditional settlement whilst reserving my position as far as any future legal recourse might be concerned.

 

Am I not correct in thinking once O/D their penalty interest applies to the whole of the outstanding balance which can include any overdraft authorised or not

[JonCris]

You don't have to claim ONLY what YOU paid. You can claim contractual interest rates for the monies THEY borrowed/stole.

 

The only difference is that you have to actualy paid them the money for them to nick it in the 1st place.

 

If the account is still outstanding you can only claim that which has been levied against you account during the period it was/is running. If you haven't yet given them the money they can't have nicked it can they

[JonCris]

Hi hageuk

 

Good post but are you not forgetting reciprocity of contract?

 

PS that according to todays press the banks have almost doubled the cost of using their cards overseas (like the baggage handlers just in time for the hols you'll note) They blame for this is being laid frimly at the door of cunsimers claiming back their charges. Now there's a surprise.

 

I think it's good news for us because each time they do something like this they shoot themselves in the foot & make even more consumers (those who can afford a holiday) aware of their shoddy tactics

[JonCris]

Not if it's the interest quoted by the bank. How are you going to prove you lost the opportunity to earn that amount interest.

 

That's like saying when are you going to stop beating your wife (or for the more PC amongst us) husband

 

Impossible & that's where the reciprocity of contract argument comes in

 

Anyway all the banks have to do is challenge the claim in court & ask us to prove how we arrived at the figure we did. Then of course we get the chance to ask the very same question.....should be interesting.

[JonCris]

Your arguments about in particular the banks social responsibilities went out of the window many years ago.

 

The courts have in the past considered the banks to be on a par with councils the utilities etc & have been reluctant to rule in any matter which would have severe affect on their ability to function because of their once perceived social role in our society

 

Not anymore. As the light begins to shine more & more on their activities the less they can claim to part of any social policy structure. It began I think when they started closing many of their branches without concern for the customer who would have to travel miles to the nearest branch & the rot has continued ever since

[JonCris]

It makes little difference as no you did not lend them the money they just took it in much the same way they claim you tried or did when you went overdrawn without their permission

[JonCris]

Also I could have loaned the £30 to a friend to help purchase something on which there was a huge profit. The arguments about what might have happened had they not taken our money could go on & on. The fact is that we have a rate & with a mind to reciprocity I suggest that rate is "fair & reasonable".

 

Where have I heard that before?

[JonCris]

think we may be getting mixed up here.

 

1.The Charges are unlawful..... the interest they charge you on charges isn't

 

But you are entitled to the interest back because you should be put in the same position as if you were not charged. ie, no charges on your account=no Overdrawn balance=no interest @29%

 

2.They charge you 29% so you can charge them the same (reciprocity)

 

 

Your confusing recovering your losses which include the charges plus the interest they added which ARE unlawful as they are now part of the unlawful charge & reciprocity which is you charging for THEIR use of YOUR money.

 

As I have already stated if you have NOT yet paid the charges & owe them you have only incurred the charges on paper & you are asking them to remove them from your account.

 

You can only claim reciprocty of contract interest on the unlawful charges you have paid

[JonCris]

yes you can but I think the rate you quote might be a little on the low side.

 

Your contractual rate will be the rate you pay for unauthorised borrowing(probably termed "purchase rate") & not your standard rate. Also don't forget to compound the rate eg £100 + 1% interest = £101 + 1% = 101.10 & so on for the whole of the period they have had YOUR money + until settlement

 

Check the T&C's

[JonCris]

Then go for the cash transaction rate. Work out the daily rate then add that rate to each days increasing balance