Aktif Kapital CCA no obligation to supply?

[NORNIRONGIRL08]

Hi

 

I am disputing defaults and debts from Aktif Kapital and sent cost for Credit Agreements got this response

 

We acknowledge receipt of your request for information uncer CCA 1974 however we are not the original creditor nor did we provide you with the original credit facility. We purchased your outstanding debt balance and right to collect that balance together with the right to apply interest in accordance with your original CA (where appropriate) We did not purchase your actual agreement consequently we have no obligation to provide you with a copy of that Agreement.

 

However, as a matter of good practice we will seek to obtain a copy of the original Agrement from the original creditor and if it is available we will forward a copy to you as soon as possible.

 

In the meantime there is no reason why our debt collection activities against you should be suspended, therefore unless we hear from you bytelephone on 01244 500656 or in writing to the above address the matter will be passed back to our collections division for further action.

 

Please note that if the original creditor is unable to provide a copy of the agreement that does not mean that we have no right to continue to request payment of the outstanding balance.

 

We are the legal owners of your account and your liability is now to us in respect of repaying the outstanding balance that was purchased by this Group of Companies.

 

it is therefore in your best interest to agree an instalment arrangement with us or discuss terms for settlement (we may give you a substantial discount on the original balance for early payment) within the next 10 days.

 

ALSO THIS IS A DISPUTED DEBT WHICH I HAVE EXPLAINED TO THEM SO WHY WOULD I AGREE A PAYMENT PLAN SURELY THIS WOULD BE ADMITTING I AM LIABLE FOR THIS DEBT. THEY HAVE ALSO PUT DEFAULTS ON MY CRF.

 

PLEASE ADVISE AND IF THERE ARE ANY FURTHER LETTERS I CAN SEND:confused: :confused:

[spamheed]

Hi

 

I am disputing defaults and debts from Aktif Kapital and sent cost for Credit Agreements got this response

 

We acknowledge receipt of your request for information uncer CCA 1974 however we are not the original creditor nor did we provide you with the original credit facility. We purchased your outstanding debt balance and right to collect that balance together with the right to apply interest in accordance with your original CA (where appropriate) We did not purchase your actual agreement consequently we have no obligation to provide you with a copy of that Agreement.

 

However, as a matter of good practice we will seek to obtain a copy of the original Agrement from the original creditor and if it is available we will forward a copy to you as soon as possible.

 

In the meantime there is no reason why our debt collection activities against you should be suspended, therefore unless we hear from you bytelephone on 01244 500656 or in writing to the above address the matter will be passed back to our collections division for further action.

 

Please note that if the original creditor is unable to provide a copy of the agreement that does not mean that we have no right to continue to request payment of the outstanding balance.

 

We are the legal owners of your account and your liability is now to us in respect of repaying the outstanding balance that was purchased by this Group of Companies.

 

it is therefore in your best interest to agree an instalment arrangement with us or discuss terms for settlement (we may give you a substantial discount on the original balance for early payment) within the next 10 days.

 

ALSO THIS IS A DISPUTED DEBT WHICH I HAVE EXPLAINED TO THEM SO WHY WOULD I AGREE A PAYMENT PLAN SURELY THIS WOULD BE ADMITTING I AM LIABLE FOR THIS DEBT. THEY HAVE ALSO PUT DEFAULTS ON MY CRF.

 

PLEASE ADVISE AND IF THERE ARE ANY FURTHER LETTERS I CAN SEND:confused: :confused:

 

 

What they are saying is rubbish, they are spouting the usual property law drivel. What they are in effect saying is that because we are not the creditor we do not have to fulfil the duties of the creditor.

The agreement that they are allegedly enforcing in respect of the Consumer credit Act, is between the debtor and the creditor - If they are not the creditor, how can you be the debtor?

 

Whether they are the creditor, or not they have an obligation to either fulfill your request personally, or forward your request to the original creditor who are obliged to fulfill your request.

 

You have made your legal request, now you need to wait until they provide you with whatever they claim is the agreement, then you can respond. in the meantime, just wait!!

[42man]

Spam is spot on....they HAVE to supply the CCA if they hope to enforce any debt, there is no LAW of property that they can use to argue their case that they don't have to supply it (they inherited the rights and the duties !!!)....if they aren't the creditor, then how can you be their debtor....they say 'we have the right to add interest depending on your agreement' WHAT AGREEMENT ??

 

You might like to read this thread too...

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/12020-elsinore-aktiv-kapital-paid.html?highlight=activ

[mojo130]

I am having fun with various DCA's at the moment. The next time I receive a letter anything like this one I will send the usual reply along with one of there favorite sayings along the line of, "Burying your head in the sand and ignoring my requests will not let your problems go away.

 

About time these people had a taste of their own medicine.

[42man]

Reproduced courtesy of Reduk054 (you will need to read through this and edit appropriately)

 

I refer to my letter dated xxxxwhich was delivered via 1st class post/recorded delivery/special delivery [delete as applicable] to your offices and received on xxxx, a copy is included for your perusal and ease of reference.

 

To date, you have failed to supply the requested documentation. These documents should be readily available as proof of your legal right to collect on this account.

 

In my letter dated the xxxx , I made a formal request for a copy of the signed, executed credit agreement for the above account under Section 77(1) and Section 78(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and a true signed copy of the Deed of Assignment. In addition, a full statement of my account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account from the time you allegedly purchased this account along with any other documents mentioned in the credit agreement.

 

You are reminded that you are obliged to supply these documents, whether you are the original creditor or not, as defined under Section 189 of the CCA 1974.

 

The Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for this request to be carried out before your company enter into a default situation. If the request is not satisfied after a further 30 calendar days, your company commits an offence. These time limits expire on***date and **date*respectively.

 

As you are no doubt aware, Section 78(6) states:

 

If the creditor, under an agreement, fails to comply with subsection (1) -

 

(a) He is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement and

(b) If the default continues for one month, he commits an offence.

 

Therefore on xdatexx, this account became unenforceable at law. No further payment will be made by myself to the account, as you have failed to comply with my lawful request under the relevant sections of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

You have failed to supply a true signed copy of the alleged agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, failed to send a full statement of the account and failed to provide a true copy of the Deed of Assignment under the relevant sections of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. Furthermore, I do not acknowledge any debt to Aktiv Kapital (UK) Ltd.

 

I require the following action from Aktiv Kapital (UK) Ltd:-

 

1. All payments made to date to Aktiv Kapital (UK) Ltd for this account should be refunded in full, including interest at the rate of 8% per annum.

 

2. Removal of all defaults entered by Aktiv Kapital. Note: this is to be a complete deletion and not merely an amendment.

 

3. I look forward to compensation under Section 13 of the Data Protection Act 1998 to be offered for the processing of my data in the manner it has been done over the past nine months.

 

4. After a full refund of all payments with interest and compensation are received by myself, you will be required under Section 10 and Section 12 of the Data Protection Act 1998, to cease and desist all manual and automatic processing of my data within your company and any other company within your group.

 

If you do not respond positively to my request, court action may be taken under Section 14 of the Data Protection Act 1998 to force Aktiv Kapital (UK) Ltd or any other company within the group, to comply with the refund of all monies paid, removal of all defaults maintained and compensation for damage and distress as a result of unlawful data processing. I may also pass the matter to the relevant enforcement authorities including, but not limited to, the Financial Crime Branch of HM Treasury, the OFT, the Information Commissioners Office, Trading Standards, the CSA, the FOS and my local MP.

 

I look forward to your reply in writing within 14 days to resolve the matter amicably and await your response.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter

[NORNIRONGIRL08]

Thanks everyone now I know wat to do, these rats think they can hassle people. So just that I got this clear their letter is just waffle meant to confuse me???

 

By the way I am not sure how to tip the Scales.

[42man]

Yes it is to confuse you !!!

 

Tip the scales by clicking on them !!

[NORNIRONGIRL08]

SENT THE LETTERS RE THE CREDIT AGREEMENTS BUT GOT THIS LETTER THIS MORNING ANY ADVICE? I THINK AFTER READING ALL ADVICE ON THIS FORUM THEY ARE IN BREACH OF OFT GUIDANCE AS THEY ARE CLEARLY AWARE THIS IS IN DISPUTE.

 

Dear Nornirongirl08

 

As you are aware your account (what account this is what I have been trying to tell them) was legally sold to the Aktiv Kapital Group of Companies some time ago, and following that assignment, we asked a Debt Collection Agent to contact you in respect of the above outstanding balance.

 

We should explain that your account has now been returned to us, consequently as legal owners, we are eager to make contact with you as soon as possible.

 

It is imperative that we resolve matters swiftly. it may be some time since you were contacted in connection with this matter so we are prepared to make the following offer.

1 Repayment each month and apply 17.5% reduction on balance

Substantial discount of 35% on outstanding balance

 

If you believe that you are not our customer (which I am not and told them this in 2 letters and a phone call on 6 March) or have a valid reason why this account should not be repaid then you should call us within next 10 days on the above telephone number.

 

ANY ADVICE????

[42man]

Wait until you hear from them again, this is a standard generic letter they send out....

[NORNIRONGIRL08]

Thank you 42man but shouldnt I write to them and inform them as this is being dispted they shouldnt be sending me letters? They also have default notices on my CRF even though I have informed them of their chasing the wrong person.

[mojo130]

Do not telephone them. It may be that you should request a copy of the CCA from them now. This will put the account in dispute and stall further actions until they comply with your request. Depending on the outcome of that request a Default letter should be sent.

 

The substantial reduction mentioned in their letter suggests that they have no valid CCA to send to you.

 

Tally ho!

[NORNIRONGIRL08]

I HAVE REQUESTED THE CCA FROM THEM AND THEIR REPLY WAS

We acknowledge receipt of your request for information uncer CCA 1974 however we are not the original creditor nor did we provide you with the original credit facility. We purchased your outstanding debt balance and right to collect that balance together with the right to apply interest in accordance with your original CA (where appropriate) We did not purchase your actual agreement consequently we have no obligation to provide you with a copy of that Agreement.

 

However, as a matter of good practice we will seek to obtain a copy of the original Agrement from the original creditor and if it is available we will forward a copy to you as soon as possible.

 

In the meantime there is no reason why our debt collection activities against you should be suspended, therefore unless we hear from you bytelephone on 01244 500656 or in writing to the above address the matter will be passed back to our collections division for further action.

 

Please note that if the original creditor is unable to provide a copy of the agreement that does not mean that we have no right to continue to request payment of the outstanding balance.

 

We are the legal owners of your account and your liability is now to us in respect of repaying the outstanding balance that was purchased by this Group of Companies.

 

it is therefore in your best interest to agree an instalment arrangement with us or discuss terms for settlement (we may give you a substantial discount on the original balance for early payment) within the next 10 days.

 

I HAVE NOTED THE DATES I SENT THE REQUESTS IE THE 12 DAY PERIOD AND THE 30 DAY PERIOD I ALSO SENT THEM A LETTER TO-DAY TELLING THEM THEY WERE IN BREACH OF OFT GUIDELINES AS THEY ARE CONTINUING TO SEEK PAYMENT OF ME EVEN THOUGH IT IS IN DISPUTE.

 

IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE I SHOULD BE DOING?

[PGH7447]

Usual standard letter from Active Krap - just file and ignore, the clock is now ticking

 

PGH7447

[ScarletPimpernel]

It may be the case that the assignment was a simple, or equitable one, in which case Aktiv may not be the creditor as defined by s.189 of the CCA 1974 - in which case they are obliged to pass the request to the creditor under s.175.

 

If the assignment is absolute, then since the loan/credit card is regulated by the CCA 1974, they are the creditor as defined by s.189, which is quite clear that an assignment is rights and duties - not one or the other.

 

Either way, their letter is just misleading pish.

[debt4get]

'Please note that if the original creditor is unable to provide a copy of the agreement that does not mean that we have no right to continue to request payment of the outstanding balance.'

think this is actually true, however, they have no legal right to pursue the debt though can continue to request payment . you however do not have to oblige them by paying

[Curlyben]

Yes it is true that they can request payment, but without the CCA enforcement action (court) is NOT possible.

[NORNIRONGIRL08]

hi

 

got another letter this morning from aktif kapital and a deed of assignment attached which has none of my details on it.

 

basically it says

 

we acknowledge receipt of your request for information under cca act 1974 however we are not original creditor nor did we provide you with original credit facility. we purchased your outstanding debt and right to collect balance together with right to appy interest in accordance with original cca where appropriate we did not purchase original agreement consequently we have no obligation to provide you with a copy of that agreement.

 

we hold a copy of agreement on a different account and await confirmation of your previous address to enable us to issue that to you. we are able to confirm we do hold copies of your original agreement on each account copy statements have been requested and will follow where available. we trust you will forward the requested address information to enable us to complete your cca request and issue the documentation you requested. in meantime no reason why activities should be suspended blah blah

Please note that the original creditor is unable to provide a copy of the agrement that does not mean that we have no right to continue to request payment of the outstanding balance.

 

we attach a copy of the deed of assignment whivh is relaevant to the four AK** portfolio accounts you hold.

 

we are the legal owners of your accounts and your liability is now to us in respect of repaying the outstanding balance that we purchases by this group pf companies.

 

 

I TOTALLY DISPUTE ALL THESE DEBTS AND HAVE TOLD THIS COMPLANY BUT STILL THEY KEEP ON AT ME PLZ PLZ ANY ADVICE ON NEXT STEP?

[ODC]

I think its time to report their sorry asses to TS and the OFT. They are talikng nonsense. Do not supply them with ANY information. You have made a LEGAL request for your CCA from them. They are obliged to comply. If they do not have it they are obliged by S175 of the CCA to pass your request on to the Original Creditor.

 

Under s189 Aktiv are defined as the Creditor. They may have bought the rights but as with all rights come responsibilities.

 

short letter to them

 

Dear AK

 

You are now in default of my Legal request for a copy of my CCA Agreement. The matter has beeen passed to the OFT and Trading Standards. I would therefore be grateful for a copy of your internal complaints procedure.

 

yours etc N.I. Girl

[NORNIRONGIRL08]

Thank You Odc

I Wasnt Very Keen On Sending Them Proof Of My Address Or Copy Of My Passport/driving Licence They Said They Confirm They Hold Copies Of Cas So Should They Have Already Sent Them Or Is It Their Legal Right Fot The Proof First

 

Many Thanks

[debt4get]

they are quite right that they have probably legally bought the debts...but....with that comes the responsibilities...they do have the right to ask you to pay, however, without the agreement they cannot legally enforce it in court, the clock is ticking...tick tock tick tock.. they have 12 working days to produce the CCA if not the account is not legally enforceable. and if I was you I would send them sod all

[ODC]

Thank You Odc

I Wasnt Very Keen On Sending Them Proof Of My Address Or Copy Of My Passport/driving Licence They Said They Confirm They Hold Copies Of Cas So Should They Have Already Sent Them Or Is It Their Legal Right Fot The Proof First

 

Many Thanks

DO NOT SEND THEM ANY PROOF. These are important documents and they have no Legal right to demand them. They are quite happy to send the threats to your home address so they must be satisfied that that is correct otherwise THEY are in breach of the Data Protection Act. There is a nice letter you can send them pointing this all out to them but they are the so called professionals so should know the law. They are in default now and will soon commit a criminal offence.

 

and if I was you I would send them sod all

The OP needs to register a formal complaint with them so as when they fail to giver her a satifactory response she can complain to the FOS and that will cost them £400

[ScarletPimpernel]

All that is required for a CCA request is the request - no proof of address, identity or signature. If Aktiv weren't sure who you were, they should have taken action to confirm before sending demands for payment. Aktiv have said that they hold agreements, so they should have forwarded them within the statutory timescale. I suspect they are bullsh!tting about the agreements anyway - the possibilities are either a Photoshopped version (which I'm sure they wouldn't do), or a blank form that may fulfill the s.78 requirement, but is unenforceable.

 

In the meantime, whilst they or the OC are in default, demands for payment are unlawful, and may also constitute harassment.

 

I'm with ODC - don't send them anything, report them to TS and start a formal complaint to Aktiv so that you can subsequently go to FOS.

[NORNIRONGIRL08]

they have stated in the letter they do have the ca but why do they need this proof are they legally right to request this from me?

[Curlyben]

*Cough* yeah right.

If that where the case why don't they send it ?!?!

 

Throw this at them and see what they have to say:

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

RE Account NO XXXXXXXX

 

Thank you for your letter dated xx/xx/2007 the contents of which are noted

 

In your letter you make reference to requiring my signed authorisation before you comply. I draw your attention to the fact that the Consumer Credit Act 1974 does not require that I supply you a copy of my signature before you comply with my S78 request.

 

If it is for Data Protection purposes then I can happily supply you with documentation to substantiate my identity to you.

 

However, please note that the above address is the one which you normally use to communicate my private business to me and which you have hitherto found to be acceptable.I have to ask if you are concerned that you are corresponding with the correct person why has it taken so long to raise this matter.

 

As you are aware, disclosing data without adequate checks of identity is contrary to the 7th principal of data protection, listed in schedule 1 of the Data protection Act 1998:

 

7. Appropriate technical and organisational measures shall be taken against unauthorised or unlawful processing of personal data and against accidental loss or destruction of, or damage to, personal data.

 

My request for a true copy of my credit agreement under section 78 was made on xx/xx/2007 and the 12 working days for your compliance expire on xx/xx/2007. I note that there is no provision that removes the requirements of the act to provide this information on time, even if you are unsure of my identity.

 

I look forward to receiving the documentation requested.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I await your rapid response.

 

Yours Faithfully,

 

[NORNIRONGIRL08]

thsnkd I will send this letter to them, to-morrow morning as the 12 day period has expired and there is another 2 weeks or so for the 30 day time limit again thanks to everyone