Buchanan Clark & Wells - IDIOTS

[Josh908]

Hello to you all. Comments / Advice gratefully received...

 

 

 

I had a number of letters from BCW claiming I owed them just under £200 for a joint account I have no knowledge of from 1998! The letters kept coming so I phoned them when I received the FINAL DEMAND and told them I DID NOT KNOW about this debt and that unless they could prove it they would get no further correspondance and certainly no money out of me. The woman on the phone advised me to get "professional help" as I would be taken to court to recover the debt.

 

The letters kept coming...

 

They sent the following computer generated photo copied letters in this sequence -

 

1) FORMAL DEMAND

2) FINAL NOTICE

3) VISIT BY DEBT INVESTIGATION OFFICER

4) LEGAL NOTIFICATION

5) NOTICE OF PENDING LEGAL ACTION (From Geoffrey Parker Bourne)

 

I sent three letters to them by recorded delivery and Royal Mail confirmed that they were delivered. BCW when asked by me on the phone said they had not received the first two letters. This just confirms that they are either just sharks out to prey on the vunerable and get whatever money they can or they are completely incompetent. These companies operate right on the edge of the law and it is JUST a numbers game to them.

 

The woman said the call was being recorded and I said "good" as I did not have any knowledge of any debt they or anyone else claimed to be owed by me. I challenged the woman on the end of the phone to send me the original signed credit agreement. She declined. I asked her how she was going to prove this debt was mine if she was unable to produce the necessary paperwork in a court of law and besides, regardless of whose debt it was it was Statute Barred. She fumbled for an answer and that is when she told me to seek "professional help".

 

The ONLY PEOPLE WHO NEED PROFESSIONAL HELP IS BCW!!

 

I then had a bit of fun and repeatedly asked her in a cheeky-chappy voice... "You don't have the agreement do you?... You don't have it... you can't get it and you can't prove anything... Have you got the Original credit Agreement?... Admit it... you haven't got it have you" etc etc.

 

They are the idiots who have bought up a load of Statue Barred debts in the hope that they can get the money back by threatening vunerable people into paying regardless of whose debt it is.

 

I've sent the Statue Barred letter adding my own little twist by asking them to CONFIRM in writing that this is Statute Barred. (They did not, but Mackenzie Hall have done previously).

 

I then sent the CCA letter with a £1 postal order which they did acknowledge by sending me two letters on the same day and returning my postal order.

 

 

One letters states:

 

I would advise that we do not hold copy credit agreements at this office as we are not the creditor...

 

 

The 2nd letter states:

 

I can confirm that I have arranged for a copy of the invoice to be sent to you directly by our clients. This will be with you as soon as possible...

 

 

 

Interesting use of the word "Invoice". I did not ask for an invoice, but the Original Credit Agreement!

 

Can I be so bold as to suggest that as the have said "as soon as possible", this Credit Agreement will NOT materialise, but that an invoice for the amount and a request for payment will! Id put money on it!!

 

The pursuer they say is THAMES CREDIT Ltd. Do I need to send the CCA letter to them and request the Credit Agreement with the £1 postal order?

As I guess at this time they have skirted their commitment to provide the CCA within 12 days by returning the postal order etc. Is this another Loop Hole!!??

 

 

Any suggestions? Anyone else been here and done that!? What should I be doing next? I can easily afford to pay what they want, but it is not mine to pay!! I am a patient man, but I am starting to lose my patience with these idiots and Id rather sort them out legally then buy "Mad Mike" a ticket and have him sort them out face to face.

[monday blues]

Hey Josh,

 

Had/ having exactly the same problem with BCW and Thames. I sent BCW a stat barred letter, they wrote back closing their file and today it has got back into the Thames, with them now pusuing this alleged debt. So having to send them a stat barred letter tomorrow.

You will find great advice here. Good luck.

[oneofakind]

I'd forget about CCA requests Josh, because:

 

a) The debt is not yours.

b) It's statute barred anyway.

 

The DCA has to prove that the debt exists, and until that happens, you don't pay! (Not that you ever will, of course!)

 

Send them another 'prove it or f**k off' letter, and ask for a copy of their complaints procedure.

 

[gavv8]

I am having the same problem with them, they keep sending me letters stating that i owe money from my ex-wife's current account.

Despite the fact that i signed a declaration in the bank over 4 years ago and have had no access to this account for the same amount of time, they just will not listen.

BCW are a pain in the backside and seemingly very stupid.

[Josh908]

Thanks for feedback so far... Good to know Im not the only one caught up in this farce. The worrying thing about all of this is that they get away with it!!

 

SOME people will crumble under this sort of pressure and just pay hoping that will be the last of it. I guarantee IF you pay they will do their damndest to find ANY other debt belonging to you and they will hound you until you cave in and pay again! (You become a target)!!

 

DO NOT PAY UP!

 

IF they back down after this one I will personally see to it that I make their lives hell. I think we have enough material amongst us to approach OFT and Credit Services etc en-mass and give them a taste of their own medicine.

 

I'll let you know what happens next...

[Conniff]

SOME people will crumble under this sort of pressure and just pay hoping that will be the last of it. I guarantee IF you pay they will do their damndest to find ANY other debt belonging to you and they will hound you until you cave in and pay again! (You become a target)!!

 

This is what shoots down the declaration that they are stupid, I would go as far as to say they are very clever.

I wonder how many people have paid a debt that they never even had, owed to a bank they have never ever banked with, but thought they must have because of the letters.

[Josh908]

This is what shoots down the declaration that they are stupid, I would go as far as to say they are very clever.

I wonder how many people have paid a debt that they never even had, owed to a bank they have never ever banked with, but thought they must have because of the letters.

 

 

Sorry Conniff - Does not take a clever person to prey on the vunerable just a devious one...

 

 

.

[Conniff]

That was a tongue in cheek comment Josh.

[Innocenti]

My OH has a debt that is statute barred as the debt it about 12 years old. We have had Thames Credit, Buchanan Clark and Wells, Geofrey Parker solicitors and ScotCall all chasing the same debt.

 

A doorstep ref for BCW actually turned up at my doorstep. I gave him the statute barred letter, bid him goodnight and slammed the door. That was about 3 months ago and it has all gone quiet.

 

No doubt it will all start up again soon. But if they think I will cave in and pay it, they are deluded!!!!!!

 

They started chasing in 2004 and my OH kept the letters hidden from me and I found out in 2005. Have to admit we did hide our heads in the sand and ignore it till I started to read up about debt in early 2006. Was so glad to read it was statute barred!!!!!

[gavv8]

Stand and deliver are the words that spring to mind.

[Conniff]

If you are certain that no payments have been made or acknowledgements made in the past six years and that it is statute barred, then send them a final letter telling them that and not to contact you again or you will take out a claim for harrasment and obtain an injunction against them.

This is costing you time and money on something that should not be happening.

[Josh908]

Just an update to say that after sending the CCA letter with a £1 postal order they wrote to say something along the lines of,

 

"We are not the creditors and do not have that documentation, we will ask the original creditor to forward these documents to you directly"... etc

 

Since then - NOTHING. NOTHING. NOTHING... (over 2 weeks ago).

 

I was expecting something, but have had NOTHING!!

 

My advice again...

 

DO NOT ACCEPT THE DEBT

DO NOT PAY ANYTHING

DO NOT PHONE THEM

DO NOT GIVE IN

 

My only advice would be to send a CCA letter with a £1 postal order straight away... rather than the two statue barred letters as this would have saved me two trips to the post office and the recorded delivery postage!

 

In my view BCW are sinister little pr*cks as they now know full well that I dispute the debt, the debt is over 10 years old and that I am NOT going to pay. Rather than bow out graciously and admit that they got it wrong, they leave it hanging in the wind and say they are passing it back to the original creditor. The original creditor or BCW can do NOTHING about it. You lose.

 

To all at BCW - I called you IDIOTS in my original post now face it, own up, you are actually a bunch of idiots. You took a gamble and lost. Now resign and go get a real job you bunch of uneducated morons.

 

Have a nice day and DO NOT PAY!

 

JOSH.

[spiritgirl59]

Hello Josh

 

Just read your post with interest and I know exactly where you are coming from.

 

BCW and Thames Credit have chased me in the past and got nowhere. I got the same old rubbish as you had:-

 

"we do not have the original documentation"

"we will ask the original creditor for the documentation" etc etc.

 

The good news is back in April this year after finding CAG, I CCA'd them, and not a word from either of them since. I doubt whether you will get anything else now Josh but I may be proved wrong.

 

So I would agree with you and say to anyone who receives demands from either of these two DCAs, or any other DCA who decides to try to hassle you, to stand firm until they get the message, no matter how long it takes, because in 9 times out of 10 their left hand does not know what their right hand is doing.

 

Its also a good idea to put a CAG sticker on all letters IMO, just to let these pillocks know we have the power of the people behind us and will not be bullied or intimidated!

 

Love Spiritgirl x

[Conniff]

I'm not sure if it is my suspicious mind or not, but there is one thing about demanding a statute barred debt that bugs me.

 

If the claimed debt is for around a couple of hundred pounds, as in your case Josh, then they will have paid no more than a couple of ££s to buy it.

 

If they can get you to SAR, then they have £10 in their sweaty mits and so have achieved their goal and made a profit on it. They don't then need to press it any further.

[Josh908]

Spiritgirl59 - Thanks for the reply / support. This Forum is great for those who need it!!

 

Conniff - I see what you are saying and I agree. However, in my case it has cost them more in postage probably than the debt cost them to buy. Im guessing that they make quite a bit of money on the 0871 numbers though! (Illegally of course)...

 

If I had more time on my hands I would make it my mission to sink these idiots piece by piece... This Forum and all its people whittling away at them could just do that!

 

Keep up the great work all of you and stick together!

 

In the meantime I will revel in what I think is another Moral Victory!!

 

CAG 1 - BCW NIL

 

Cheers, Josh.

[spamheed]

Taken from a telecoms company website

 

quote

 

"0871 Numbers - Fixed Rate 0871 Telephone Numbers

 

0871 numbers can generate income for your company. These numbers are excellent alternative to 0870 numbers because each minute can earn you extra income that can be off-set against other telephone costs. Customers that call you are billed at up to 10p/min fixed rate, regardless of their location within the UK.

 

Your business receives a payment of 4 to 6 pence per minute for every peak call you receive."

 

Also confirmation from another site that these telephone cons are recognised as a rip off

 

quote

 

"And in recent weeks it's emerged that rogue diallers have been using 0871 numbers to con consumers as well. Although these cost net users around 10p a minute, they can still rack up hefty charges over a long period of time.

 

It's too early to say how widespread the [problem] is, but over the last three or four weeks communications regulator Ofcom has begun receiving five or six complaints a week about the 0871 rogue dialler scams.

 

BT has also acknowledged that it's also recently been made aware of 0871 dialler scams.

 

The acknowledgement from Ofcom and BT confirms reports from industry insiders that the menace of rogue diallers - which have hit ten of thousands of people in the UK - is changing.

 

One insider told us: "These calls generate lower volumes for rogue dialler operators but are harder to detect."

 

The UK's Citizens Advice (CAB) has warned net users to be on the guard against "shocking" rogue dialler scams after reporting that more and more people are seeking help and advice after being scammed. "

[Josh908]

BT has also acknowledged that it's also recently been made aware of 0871 dialler scams.

 

 

The acknowledgement from Ofcom and BT confirms reports from industry insiders that the menace of rogue diallers - which have hit ten of thousands of people in the UK - is changing.

 

One insider told us: "These calls generate lower volumes for rogue dialler operators but are harder to detect."

 

The UK's Citizens Advice (CAB) has warned net users to be on the guard against "shocking" rogue dialler scams after reporting that more and more people are seeking help and advice after being scammed. "

 

 

 

"Scammed" That is a great word to associate with Debt Recovery Agencies. If 10,000 people write to the Oxford English Dictionary we could get that amended... (not sure if it is 10,000 or not)!?

 

Scammed - See "Debt Recovery Agency" page 251 etc!

[Josh908]

Just an update to say that after sending the CCA letter with a £1 postal order they wrote to say something along the lines of,

 

"We are not the creditors and do not have that documentation, we will ask the original creditor to forward these documents to you directly"... etc

 

Since then - NOTHING. NOTHING. NOTHING... (over 2 weeks ago).

 

I was expecting something, but have had NOTHING!!

 

My advice again...

 

DO NOT ACCEPT THE DEBT

DO NOT PAY ANYTHING

DO NOT PHONE THEM

DO NOT GIVE IN

 

My only advice would be to send a CCA letter with a £1 postal order straight away... rather than the two statue barred letters as this would have saved me two trips to the post office and the recorded delivery postage!

 

In my view BCW are sinister little pr*cks as they now know full well that I dispute the debt, the debt is over 10 years old and that I am NOT going to pay. Rather than bow out graciously and admit that they got it wrong, they leave it hanging in the wind and say they are passing it back to the original creditor. The original creditor or BCW can do NOTHING about it. You lose.

 

To all at BCW - I called you IDIOTS in my original post now face it, own up, you are actually a bunch of idiots. You took a gamble and lost. Now resign and go get a real job you bunch of uneducated morons.

 

Have a nice day and DO NOT PAY!

 

JOSH.

 

##############################################

##############################################

##############################################

Just wanted to let everyone know that the IDIOTS at BCW have NOT bothered me since this post back in Nov 07. NOTHING... NADA... NIL

 

Read my advice above. If it is Statute Barred DO NOT PAY.

(Check your situ first though as it might not be if it is different to mine)!!

 

I can now "officially" say that BCW are a bunch of IDIOTS who need to get proper jobs as there is no law against stating "FACT"...

(Well not yet anyway).

 

Cheers!

[bjb]

I took out a mobile phone contract in October 2006 for my daughter, she landed me with a phone bill of 122.00. After a disscussion with o2 i was told my daughter could use her allowance of 200 txts and 200 minutes and go 10 pound over and then they would put a barr on. On the next bill they put the barr on her phone after just 38 minutes and 38 txts. After numerous phone calls and going into the shop i was told the barr might come of after 3 months so i cancelled my direct debit as i wasnt paying for something i have not got. o2 passed my outstanding line rental of 283.83 to BCW who sent me a letter. After a phone call to them i offered to pay them 25.00 per month the cost of the mobile contract but they would not accept that. I was told i had to pay 100.00 pound the first month, 100.00 the second month followered by the 83.83 i told them i couldnt afford that but was told i had too or a debt officer would come to my home. i paid the first then borrowed money for the second so i now owe 83.83 i have asked if i can pay this at 10.00 per week but they wont accept it. Can they refuse?

[haymans74]

Hello Josh

 

BCW and Thames Credit have chased me in the past and got nowhere. I got the same old rubbish as you had:-

 

"we do not have the original documentation"

"we will ask the original creditor for the documentation" etc etc.

 

The good news is back in April this year after finding CAG, I CCA'd them, and not a word from either of them since. I doubt whether you will get anything else now Josh but I may be proved wrong.

 

 

That's exactly what has happened with us and Thames/BCW. We CCAd them and got the same

 

"we do not have the original documentation"

"we will ask the original creditor for the documentation" etc etc.

 

Not heard a peep since and it was over 2 weeks ago that we sent the CCA letter.

 

I'm not paying a penny until they prove it's our debt!!

[eileen58]

Hi Just subscribing, I am dealing with this bunch of twits for my son concerning an electricity bill.

I have just wrote them a great letter that I pinched from another thread and I hope that we will not hear anything more from them.

I am also compiling a list of faults and I am going to make an official complaint to everyone that I can think off.

I am just waiting for my son's credit report to see if they have defaulted him and then I really will hit the fan with all there rubbish.

[spiritgirl59]

o2 passed my outstanding line rental of 283.83 to BCW who sent me a letter. After a phone call to them i offered to pay them 25.00 per month the cost of the mobile contract but they would not accept that. I was told i had to pay 100.00 pound the first month, 100.00 the second month followered by the 83.83 i told them i couldnt afford that but was told i had too or a debt officer would come to my home. i paid the first then borrowed money for the second so i now owe 83.83 i have asked if i can pay this at 10.00 per week but they wont accept it. Can they refuse?

 

Hi bjb

 

Best to start a separate thread in future if you have a query, cos putting it into another thread can sometimes means your question gets overlooked

 

Well in theory they can refuse, but you need to stick to your guns here and tell them (in writing) that is all they are getting ! IMO what you are paying is more than fair and reasonable and they are being the typical plonkers that they always are. Bear in mind that they will not have paid anything like £283.83 for this debt when they acquired it from O2, so anything they get back is a bonus for them, and to get back the whole lot like this they will think Christmas has come early!

 

Don't worry about them calling round, this rarely happens and you are perfectly entitled to tell them to get lost. Here is a letter you can send to them if you are worried about someone calling (and keep a copy by your door to hand to a debt collector IF he/she calls, which I must stress is very unlikely):-

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

Ref xxxxxxxx

 

Please be advised that I am only prepared to communicate with you in writing and therefore, if it remains your intention to arrange a “doorstep call”, please be advised that under OFT rules, you can only visit me at my home if you make an appointment and I have no wish to make an appointment with you.

 

There is only an implied license under English Common Law for people to be able to visit me on my property without express permission; the postman and people asking for directions etc (Armstrong v. Sheppard and Short Ltd [1959] 2 Q.B. per Lord Evershed M.R.).

 

Therefore take note that I revoke license under Common Law for you, or your representatives to visit me at my property, and if you do so, then you will be liable to damages for a tort of trespass. You would also be conspiring in a trespass if you sent someone to visit me nevertheless. Should it be necessary, I will obtain an injunction.

 

Yours faithfully

(with thanks to ODC for this letter)

 

Don't speak to them on the phone anymore, only deal with them in writing. Send them the £10 a week as you promised and keep a record of everything. Let them keep threatening you - by the time they would get their act together to take this further you will have paid it all off anyhow IMO. They are bullies bjb but if you stand up to them they will back off I have found.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Love SG x