hi jojo Having looked through the threads and the links above I think your situation falls into one of the following: a. You took out an agreement under age, telling the truth about your age on your paperwork. At 18 you ratified the agreement. b. You took out an agreement under age, telling the truth about your age on your paperwork. At 18 you did not ratify the agreement. c. You took out an agreement under age, not telling the truth about your age on your paperwork. At 18 you ratified the agreement. d. You took out an agreement under age, not telling the truth about your age on your paperwork. At 18 you did not ratify the agreement. e. You took an agreement out under age and someone guaranteed you would pay back the amount. At 18 you ratified the agreement. f. You took an agreement out under age and someone guaranteed you would pay back the amount. At 18 you did not ratify the agreement. g. You have nothing to do with this agreement. (Not likely but listed here for completion. a to g covers all the possible scenarios I can think of but perhaps other CAGers could add any more they think of. The term ratification I have pulled from the linked thread above and my understanding of it is that when you reached 18 you were then considered old enough in law to agree as an adult to the loan you took out as a child (to put it simply). Your next move May depend upon which of the a to g scenarios you are in. CAUTION I am not legally trained, just trying to make sense of the situation. Wait to see what other CAGers say about my assessment of the current situation. if you think one of the statements a to g applies to you please say so as that might steer the thread in a useful direction.

Best of Luck.

hi Elizabeth The family business in which I work is retail so I can see the situation from the other side, but I am on your side. You have already admitted it was wrong, and have learned from it. It is time to move on and stop beating yourself up. Look on the bright side; at least the cookie didn't find its way onto your hips! From here on out it should be business. M&S chose not to take criminal proceedings and they did that for business reasons, not out of any compassion for you as such. This business of civil recovery is all about two things, making money out of you and setting an example, and you should have no compunction in my view about avoiding that from happening, simply because it is a business matter and not criminal. Whatever other CAGers suggest to you to get out of it as much as possible you should consider and follow if it seems like a good idea. Any restitution you may want to make can be done after the event and could for example be a donation to charity (Find out what M&S gives to) or something like that if you feel you need to "re-pay". Or you could volunteer to help others as others on here are enriching their lives by helping you. I hope other CAGers do not interpret my post as an endorsement of crime. This is trying to be about forgiveness and positive restitution. (Hope this lot doesn't sound too pompous!) Anyway, good luck.

Hi Buzzard I would say the advice is for both of you.

Hi Elizabeth T Would you mind telling your story a little bit? From your post I get the impression you feel you are guilty of something. If it was a genuine mistake perhaps you have no need to feel guilty. If you genuinely are guilty then you need some forgiveness and support somewhere. Paying out to these bloodsuckers might work psychologically for you, but perhaps something else would be better and more appropriate? The fact that you feel the need to make a restitution, whether you do or not, proves you are a good person and deserving of any support and help we can give.

Hi wrungout Yes. Do the C78 request first. Do all the other things and be prepared to offer reduced payments on those agreements that are enforceable. Even these may be challengeable in part due to unfair fees etc. I cant speak for PGH but looking back on his posts it seems he takes that view.

PGH

I agree 100% with reallymadwoman on all her points. If they try and push for more come back on this site with what they say.

I think their logo looks like two crows having a hump.

Hi joejoe Given you are now 22 and the debts go back to 2005 how old were you when you took out the debts? What I am getting at is were you 18 when these agreements were started?

Hi PGH I am completely with you, never fear. Just personally cautious about what I want to advise.

Hi First of all do not panic. There are many people here who will help you. Second the debt collectors are largely ineffective if you know how to handle them and you will learn how here. The following is an initial action plan that will do until others post up more specific information. 1. The DCA will very likely not make a personal appearance. If he does he has no right of entry, you do not have to talk to him and I would suggest you do not. In the very unlikely event that someone shows up tell them written communications only and close the door. (Forgive me for asking but how many months pregnant are you as this can have a bearing on doorstep visits from collectors). 2. You will likely get phone calls. Do not talk to them. If they call, hang up. If they call again, leave the phone off hook for a while. 3. They will send you a lot of letters. These letters look serious but I have a very large number of them which I treat as a kind of stamp collection, but there are people on here with many more than I including some penny blacks and other very rare and entertaining items! You will need to address some of them but for your initial action plan (say the next couple of weeks) you do not need to worry about them. As they arrive get them scanned and put up here so people can see them (removing personal details). 4. For others to help you they will need some information so please answer as many of the following that you can: a. Who is the original creditor? b. When did you start the agreement? c. Have you got a copy of the agreement? d. What type of loan/credit/debt is it? e. How much was it for and how much is left? f. When did you make the last payment/attempt? g Did you receive a Default Notice? h. If the original creditor has closed the account did you get a Termination Notice. i. Did the original Creditor sell the debt on? If they did then did you get a notice of assignment? j Following from above did the new debt owner send you an introductory letter. Dont worry if you dont know what some of these things are. I didn't when I first came on this site. Just post back and say what you dont understand and you will get back loads of explanation. Also dont worry if you cant find all the info. sooner or later it will emerge. A couple of other thoughts: k. Did you enter into this agreement, or did your other half enter into it, or did you enter into it jointly, or is it possible it has nothing to do with you? l. Given your circumstances the worst outcome I can realistically see happening is that IF you are liable for the debt you none the less have no spare money. The realistic outcome of this is you would do a personal statement of income and expenditure and offer a token payment of £1 per month. The DCA would huff and puff but have little choice in the end but to accept. So although the situation is potentially serious it can be managed and I would think you have a good chance of a positive outcome. Wait for a while before doing any irrevocable things in order to see what other posts you get on this thread as there are a lot of clever people waiting to help you. In the mean time try to chill. Congratulations on your baby. My wife and I have been trying for some time and from where I am sitting you are very lucky indeed!

Hi PGH Thanks for your endorsements and I completely agree with your additional comments. I am just personally a little nervous about being seen to encourage someone to avoid debt, as my posting on another thread attracted a rebuke. However, if it was me I would do what you suggested, as it is completely legal.

Hi What is the date you applied for the card? Do you have their refusal letter? What is its date? Do you have the first statement you received after using it? (Just trying to establish when the agreement, if one can be said to exist here, may have started). What was the date of the last payment you made or the last attempt of payment made from your bank if it was a DD? (Just trying to establish if the last payment/attempt was made earlier than 14th Jan 2004 or 2005 if you are in Scotland). Did you receive a default notice? did you receive a termination notice? It looks like the debt was sold on. If so did you receive a notice of assignment from Capital One? did you receive a letter from the new owner of the debt saying they were the new owner? The answers to these questions may have a bearing on your next moves. Good luck.

gdk Don't worry and don't beat yourself. This is a learning experience and by the time it is all finished you will have developed a lot of new knowledge and skills, and having looked into the furnace, you know you will be able to take the heat.

Hi First of all you have my deepest sympathy as I have been working in the family business for the last three years in similar circumstances. Here is a partial action plan I put forward for you and other CAGers to view and comment upon. 1. You need to establish some peace. Therefore write to all the credit card providers with the telephone harassment letter. With any luck the calls will drop off. 2. You need to do a personal income and expenditure sheet to work out your priority debts. Can I ask if you operate your business separately from your household finances? If so perhaps you should do a separate business plan and cash flow forecast so that you can determine what income you will be likely to get from the business this year and when you will get it. These figures can then be punched into your personal income and expenditure sheet. 3. Once you have your personal sheet worked out see what spare cash you have after your priority debts. Divide this amongst your creditors and write to each of them offering what you can afford. My experience of the card companies is that despite the entreaties we get to call them when you get into trouble they really do not want to know. Each of them wants there own debt paid and care not for the others. Ignore any demands for additional payments. It is not them that tell you what to pay it is you who is uniquely placed to work out what you can afford. Some of them may ask for a copy of your income/expenditure sheet or ask you to fill in their own. It is up to you but you have no legal obligation to provide this to them and I personally would not do so or engage in any conversation/correspondence with them over the amount of repayments. The attitude should be that you control the repayments which you manage on behalf of all creditors as a group. As a precaution I would cancel any DD’s you have with the card companies and set up standing orders instead. 4. If you have creditors in the business you can do the same thing. The creditors would be more likely than not to be people like trade suppliers. Write to each of them explaining your circumstances and offer them monthly figures. I have done this for three years and assure you in almost all cases the creditor will accept your offer provided you can stick to it. By the way it is more than possible that your card issuers will get heavy with you. This is just business as far as they are concerned. For that reason you need have no compunction about challenging the enforceability of their agreements if they choose not work with you. That is just business too. Hopefully the above actions will get you back on your feet. Now you need to start walking. If the above is under control and not occupying your time you can try to look at some positive things you can do to improve business which is easier said than done because I have been trying for three years myself and I know it is not easy. Also, wait a while to see what other posts are made on your thread as others will have good ideas and likely better than mine. Best of luck

Mrs Blackadder :D:D:D:D

I would agree. It does no harm to open another account just in case. I have a basic bank account with Halifax recently opened despite a poor credit record.

Hi gdk Subbing means I am following your thread with interest but have nothing to contribute except my moral support. By subbing I get emails when new posts are added and I can follow what is going on. I am just a normal member of CAG with no special knowledge Don't worry. It looks like you are being looked after.

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Worth using the PO track and trace on postal orders to see if they banked it. If you still have the PO receipt it will have the tracking number and the PO web site should be able to tell you if it has been cashed. If it has print off the web page and send it to them. You can at that point prove they had payment and they will be out of time. If you are in a hurry you might resend your request doing exactly the same thing but this time get a witness to see you seal the PO in the letter and write their own simple witness statement to go inside the envelope saying; "this letter was sealed by WITNESS NAME who verified payment was enclosed and who posted the letter". Signed and dated by the witness. Its a Pain in the A but puts the pressure back on them and it's only a quid. Good luck.

Hi Keep a daily log of the meter, recording the starting units the ending units and subtract one from the other to see how many units are being used. This would give you the begginings of an idea of the daily consumption. Once you have this post it up on here and others with more experience may be able to tell you if the consumption seems excessive for a domesitc property at this time of the year. Also, contact the Gas company ask them how much a unit you are being charged. Then work out if the money you are putting in is roughly equal to the number of units being used. That would tell you if the metering is accurate. It might be possible to switch to a cheaper supplier. Here is a couple of tips to reduce consumption that may be useful: 1. See if you can stop using one or more of the rooms for the duration of the winter. If so, turn off the radiators in those rooms. 2. Get some cardboard and cut it to fit between radiators and external walls. Then cover it in silver foil. This will reflect some of the heat back into the room and stop some of the heat radiating into the external walls. 3. Is the building double glazed? If not here is a tip for "temporary double glazing" a. Buy some strips of 1 cm x 2 cm cross section wood and build frames that fit the windows. b. Cover the frames with cling film on both sides. c. Optionally cover the external edges in a foam material to create a better seal. The above will provide an extra layer over your windows and help to warm the rooms. 4. Are the radiators working efficiently? They should be full of water but from time to time air gets in. check them and if necessary bleed them. I am not sure if this last tip helps with economy as such but it sure helps with heating and would allow you to turn the thermostat down.

Tom Tubby makes excellent points. You should try and get this years tax paid before the next year starts if at all possible. However, if you cannot, then you should explain to the council why you cannot. To help with this you may find that most councils issue bills with ten instalments on them starting April. Check if this happens in your area. Ideally you should aim to repay by the end of March. However, if this is not possible then aim for monthly repayments that include April and May and your next year liability will just have to wait until June before you start to pay it and you should try to get the council to agree. You should discuss this with the council and try to reach an agreement. If they wont do it approach your local councillors or even MP. After all you are not trying to avoid payment, just struggling. As a local citizen I would expect my council to collect tax from all other citizens but I would not expect or desire that the council (which serves me) to be bullying and causing hardship to my fellow citizens that are struggling. You need to take this attitude, that you are willing but struggling and have a right to consideration, to the Council and if necessary, your councillors and MP.

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