I like Chips, and have had loads recently. I let it go ages ago as I realise it is them who have issues. Unfortunately it is making them let go that is going to be the problem in future. Although now I have a way forward, Thanks again

Emmzzi you are spot on in your observations. The problems started when the workload started increasing and I couldn't manage to do it all any more and started to back off a bit. I was then accused of "refusing" to do things and having conflicts with others, whereas it just became physically impossible to cope. I think that the complaints were maliciously prompted by NM who just wanted me out of their way so that they could choose new staff from their fan club. NM has obviously also been bitching about me behind my back to BB who I previously got on very well with. Following the referral at the time, Occ Health wrote to BB telling them to sort out the issues I had raised, and that these were absolutely management issues that must be addressed to avoid me suffering from stress, however by the time I had gone to the appointment I had already been suspended. I still have a copy of that letter...

Thanks Emmzzi, I agree right versus wrong is not a helpful way to think and that any incidents should be considered objectively so that effective solutions can be implemented, and that a no blame culture is evidently better so that staff are able to raise any concerns in confidence without fear of victimisation to improve health and safety at work for everyone. This is a legal obligation after all and not optional !! Ironically, I was coming to the same conclusions as you that it was time to move on, however events have overtaken and prevented this which probably would have happened by now anyway... I like your explanation about conflict, due to the nature of people there is always going to be some element of conflict in day to day life and at work, it is how it is dealt with that is key. The BB has obviously tried to cover her own backside by turning this around on me, and I have not been in a position to defend myself properly so far, as I have been outnumbered and the union rep has been useless. We are under professional obligation to raise concerns in writing without delay, the problem is that you are damned if you do (ie blamed for the issues somehow) and damned if you don't if something then happens and it turns out you had not said anything but then raise concerns in your defence!! An automatic no win situation open to abuse by managers who choose to bully rather than manage. I do find your comments helpful. It is kind of a way of stating facts about how I will continue to do my best and raise issues as appropriate so that they are aware at the time then if there are any more "incidents" it can be shown again that I have raised issues in a timely way. That continues to put the onus back onto them to manage the situation properly, which is appropriate as they are the employer. They are not going to like it still, but if I soften it enough and make it sound reasonable then it is going to be more difficult for it to be used against me in future. You have given me something to start working with, Thank you

OK then: I start new job replacing two staff who were there previously. My Manager is based elsewhere but can contact if needed, which is rare as I am experienced. Very busy and obviously understaffed, I request assistance regularly in writing, help is sometimes available but not always. Someone makes a complaint about a senior member of staff, that person thinks it is me and starts refusing to communicate properly insisting everything is done via email, I request a meeting to sort this out, senior person who was complained about goes of sick for about six months and never attends the meeting. A new member of staff is redployed to assist me following being off sick for six months or so, who was a team leader but got bullied out by her staff, this person is more concerned about booking days off and holidays than doing any work and is generally adding to my stress levels, I have a word and say come on the work needs to be done and she requests a transfer. I am gradually getting worn out and write again asking for help, someone is allocated to help temporarily as service changes are now starting to happen although nothing is consulted or organised properly. New Manager starts and my helper returns to their usual job, NM clearly has no intention of doing any work and generally wafts round and not communicating with me, we also have a new staff member start and a student plus our shifts are changing and the service is moving location and increasing in size so although we have more staff, they are more thinly spread if you see what I mean. I raise some safety concerns verbally with NM and then in writing with Big Boss Big Boss responds by emailing the people who run the service we are contracted to, that Starlight has raised concerns. A meeting is held to discuss, I am given work to do to sort out the concerns. I am very stressed and tearful at times, BB asks if I am OK and I say NM does not seem to be doing much and it is all falling to me again / still. I am looking forward to taking holiday the following week. BB says she is referring me to Occ Health. I go on holiday. Get Occ Health referral which makes out I have been having conflicts with various staff but this is resolved - ?? On my return from leave I am suspended by BB and taken to do alternate duties, told an investigation is underway but not why other than allegations have been made. Investigation is apparently into alleged mistakes I have made several weeks prior to going on leave and general behaviour issues. Investigation drags on for months and months. I have one meeting where I am told NM has made a complaint about me and email NM sent is read out. Outcome meeting where I am told I can go back, need to have mediation with NM first. All staff to do training on communication and documentation "to make it look like we are doing something". At mediation NM states it was not them but BB who put NM up to making complaint. No agreement reached. BB calls me into office and says mediation failed so you are on redeployment and still suspended. I raise complaint with HR verbally, request further mediation as suggested, this is refused. Nothing happens, I raise grievance. Months later a facilitated meeting is arranged. Morning with NM and afternoon with BB. At facilitated meeting NM states they did not know why we needed mediation. In afternoon BB states all this is because of my behaviour. At the end it is left I will return but BB gets to arrange details, I say I need to take leave first as I am exhausted. Come back from leave and list of hoops to jump through before I can go back is revealed. I sit each day doing nothing whilst union rep and BB argue over when I can return etc. I give in and get signed off. Unsurprisingly after over a year of this I am worn out and even more stressed!! Apparently if I don't write a short essay about how the whole thing is due to my behaviour then I may now be disciplined for not writing that anyway. It is obvious that I was stressed and unsupported and I have evidence to show this, the complaints were malicious as I had raised concerns. If I write that which is my honest appraisal of events, BB will likely refuse my return to post as I "haven't learned". I would say my grievance is unresolved. So, what would you write?? Any helpful replies gratefully received

Aw, come on, you never know!

Thanks Emmzzi, appreciate your reply, sadly I agree with you. If anyone has any suggestions of how to write about something without taking the blame, still keeping your dignity intact but satisfying the blood suckers, I would be grateful? Union rep keeps harping on that I have to do it or could be a disciplinary, reckons this is possible, along the lines of do it but cross your fingers behind your back, however I have never heard anything so ridiculous in all my life, we are supposed to be professional adults but its nothing but a school playground except less mature. I mean, really!! Why would anyone do that, even if they were guilty of something! It is purely sadistic "management". (More commonly known as Bullying and Harassment).

OK so it seems I was maybe a little hasty in my celebrations.... The arrangements about the details of how and when me returning to my post would happen were handed back to the Big Boss to sort out and guess what? There's a catch... The "informal recommendation" highlights of this is going to involve lots and lots of humiliating re-induction over about six weeks (longer than when I first started the job), where I have to be paraded round different departments like the new person, oh and write a short essay about what happened, how it is my fault, and how I will do better in the future, "to show you have learned a lesson". I am going to be allocated a personal supervisor too. Hhhmmm. I feel I am simply being set up for round two of more bullying and harassment. The circumstances which lead to this are beyond my control but if I say that then I am not "learning a lesson". Jeez. As I was already at the end of my tether with this months ago, and the union are being spectacularly useless about it and refusing to deal with it properly all along, which has resulted in me finally being signed of work now as my health can't take any more, does anyone have any suggestions of what to do next? I requested a next stage Grievance meeting over a week ago but have not heard anything as yet.

OK, so..... update: I went to the meetings, the whole process lasted most of the day. I'm shattered now but from what I could make out my union rep had spoken to Big Boss's Boss and they decided to "get it sorted" via this approach of a facilitated meeting. I have to say I had just about lost all faith in anyone and anything ... however, Outcome is, I am returning to my post !!! All new manager was bothered about was that they were off the hook, and Big Boss still reckoned it was all my fault, but hey, you can't have everything, Right? Thank you to everyone who contributed to my thread and especially Altobelli, I really couldn't have done it without you ...and now I really need to get some sleep...

Altobelli, thank you, as ever for your fantastic and detailed advice. I agree the union reps are surplus to requirement. It is my union rep who has arranged this without discussing with me. I suspect this has been arranged because the new manager has refused mediation so has been allowed a union rep to try and encourage them to agree to attend. As you say hiding behind others. As far as I am aware there are no pre-meetings with the facilitator. Just a pre meeting for me with my union rep to tell me what it is all about as not been told much before hand. I am already very wary that this is a set up, but following your advice I am going to go along and see what happens, and withdraw from the process if I am not comfortable with how it is going. Thank you so much for your input, it is very much appreciated.

Altobelli, yes that is right. There are two union reps going to be present, one for me and one for the new manager. The new manager's union rep is also the person who I have been allocated to work with as my line manager during my alternate duties and, after previously being very nice to me and getting me to do loads of their work and praising me for doing all this very well and in writing too, following me raising a grievance has shouted at me in front of witnesses in an open plan office who were disgusted with this behaviour, and given me instructions which were wrong (I did not know that at the time) then blamed consequent complaints from others about this on me. When I complained about this to higher manager, a meeting was held to discuss and left unresolved, I was left working with this person who went very quiet for a couple of weeks and has now started being funny with me again. This person is also friends with my external union rep, who discouraged me from making a complaint about the above behaviour. The letter I was sent makes no mention of this person being present, I only know as hr confirmed on phone Friday. I have not been given any more details about the proposed meeting but the format has been changed by them, I originally asked for a three way meeting with myself, new manager and big boss to clear up any outstanding issues and that was some months ago now, and was refused as was another more recent offer of further mediation with me and new manager only. I suspect this "see if we can work together" is a set up and new manager is going to refuse as advised by their union rep. I didn't think managers could take a union rep!! Thus rubber stamping big bosses "decision" to force me to move post even though this is unjustified as there are no grounds. What do you think I should do? My union rep says they will discuss with me before I go in but I have already said I feel totally unprepared and should not be effectively walking in blind? Any concerns raised by me have been ignored so I do not expect this to change on the day.

Thank you and as always, I am very grateful for your detailed and very helpful input to this saga! Well, there have been some last minute developments and I wanted to run them past you, (meeting is scheduled for early next week). New manager will be bringing their union representation who is the same person I have been allocated to as my current line manager and the same person who has been also trying to constantly cause trouble for me since I raised my grievance about being refused a return to my post. HR let it slip when I spoke to them on the phone yesterday, and I was not aware previously this person would be there. I asked about the Agenda, this will be set on the day with the Terms of Reference apparently, we also each (not sure who this is referring to) need to bring two issues to be resolved?! I have raised concerns about the above current line manager/new manager's union rep, with my rep but they are friends and so this has not been taken seriously and they have threatened to withdraw support if I don't do as I'm told by my rep, basically !! The outcome of the investigation was I am to return to my post following mediation and that new manager must support this. I think you are correct Altobelli that new manager has tried to sabotage this and I also know now that their rep has been heavily involved in foul play regarding this, whilst using me to do loads of work for them !! Question is how can I overcome this? Without appearing unreasonable (as this is the set up). I could refuse to go through with the facilitated meeting (it is not part of the grievance procedure anyway), or go ahead and stop it to go more formal following your advice as to when / if above, however my concern with that is my union rep may try and stop me doing this? How would I deal with that if it happens? Can I insist new managers union rep is excluded from the process? (I think new manager will then withdraw if that happens). my union rep has also told me second meeting with big boss may not go ahead depending on how the first meeting goes but did not explain why. Basically I am not being given straight answers and being made out to be difficult if I ask them anything... so your help is invaluable to me, and thank you for any further advice, I really am most grateful.

Altobelli, thank you so much for your excellent advice and input on this. I have noted all your points above and have one further question, should a facilitated meeting have Terms of Reference (including a list of attendees) and should these be shared with all attendees in advance of the meeting?

Hi Altobelli, it is good to hear from you, your input is very much appreciated. I agree that the proposed meeting is a good idea in principle. Unfortunately the reality is quite different. This is not a mediation, it is a facilitated meeting. A further mediation has been refused point blank by new manager as they "did not find the process useful" whatever that means. I am not sure I know the difference between mediation and a facilitated meeting? A series of meetings is planned - 9am me and union rep, 10am me, new manager, chaired by new HR senior person plus union rep who has said they will be there for hand holding only, then 12.30 - 2pm same again but with big boss instead of new manager, not sure when or if there will be a lunch break and the second meeting with big boss will only go ahead depending on how new manager meeting goes. Meetings are to establish if we can work together professionally and to seek agreement to do the same. If new senior hr person deems process has failed then I will be permanently removed from my post. I am not sure other than as above how the process will work, or how I can get what I want out of it. If I say nothing then I will be accused of not participating, if I say anything it will be used against me and anyway at the end this new manager who has made unfounded complaints against me, which has meant me be suspended indefinitely, gets to decide if they can work with me or not (this will be a direct question of both of us at the end) and all they have to say is no then that is me finished? I noted from your earlier advice you said to refuse if a series of meetings were planned (to go ahead with this has been a suggestion of the union rep) and to watch for people getting stories straight in advance, which I am almost certain will happen, although not sure how to deal with this if it does? I am considering refusing to attend any of these meetings and ask that this matter now be dealt with formally, however hr person now dealing with it has already said outcome of that will be... yes you guessed it.... a facilitated meeting. I may lose the will to live with these people very soon . Please, do you have any further advice? I have submitted a grievance but they are not taking it seriously it would seem... oh and grievance has nothing to do with new manager, just asking for a return to my post since the investigation was finished months ago. I was told at the follow up meeting that that is my job and asked if I want to go back and I have said yes. That is what was meant to have happened post mediation, however new manager came in to the mediation and sabotaged that. If the new manager has made allegations about me, I have not been formally informed of anything?

OK so this is still ongoing.... Union Rep is making situation even worse... This is not a working relationships issue, but they are trying to use that as an excuse. A series of facilitated meetings is now being proposed, however I have re-read Altobelli's advice above and am hoping for some further guidance on how to resolve this situation and return to my post. Facilitated meetings are not part of the Grievance procedure, I have stated and re-stated I am willing to attend mediation, new manager has refused this, I have also stated I do not think this can be resolved informally and they have come back with the above proposal re a series of facilitated meetings which they say my union rep says I have agreed to (I have not). Altobelli if you are out there, please could you help me with the above? Thank you in advance for any further help and or advice.

Thanks Emmzzi. I am as frustrated as everyone else about the situation and there isn't really one clear course of action. I am being drip fed what is going on and just trying my best to work something out. I have offered to sort it and others are being difficult which is hindering, but I won't let myself be ground down - don't really see what is wrong with that? It is always a wise idea to seek support and advice and also to recognise what is helpful and what is duff advise. Unions have their uses but sometimes they are part of the problem for various reasons. (What do you mean by the Union advice I have been given is not great?). Going to see what happens and come back here if I need to. If you or anyone else does have any more thoughts I am always interested in listening and discussing, as that is what a forum is for!