I still think it is ridiculous that someone can buy a car, drive it 000's of miles service it themselves "cough cough" and then 4/5 months later complain about a problem no matter how big or small and expect a refund or repair? the SOGA is a joke in this respect and it really needs to be looked at, yes there are cowboy dealers out there but there are a lot of honest traders that fall foul of this joke system...

I will monitor the progress of this, and my spouting off as you so rudely put it is my views on the subject from the other side of the fence...and in my opinion are relevant to the situation being discussed.

Yes but would Helio have looked at the car and taken it from there? Its always easy to cast views in this situation until your actually there....

In response to sailor sam...of course my cars are checked before being sold..most are sold with full mot and also warranty, unfortunately there are situations where things just happen in regards to used vehicles no matter how well they are checked prior to sale...The SOGA is totally ridiculous in regards to used vehicles and should be seriously looked at...Is it so hard to believe that a great car with fsh, full mot, rac inspection, can develop a fault 1 week after sale....of course this would never happen? and when it does the dealer of course is always to blame....all car dealers are called arthur daley yes?

Nothing to do with being an expert i am just looking at things from the other side, something which people dont seem to want to do here. Ok Helios i will put the same question to you...If you sold me your car and i came and paid you and drove away, i then took the car to holland and back and also carried out some part replacements myself ( no matter how easy) after 4/5 months i phone you up and say i want my money back what would you do? would you just pay up happily? im sure the answer is no...you would scrutinise the situation the same way i have.....

In a later post you hypothetically ask what the situation is had the scenario been reversed................E r you are the trader and as such are expected to be able to spot the faults by being an "expert"....or are you saying you are not an "expert" so perhaps are in the wrong proffession?? What on earth are you on about?

I dont get how its reducing consumer rights as long as your not hiding anything, If i sell someone a bag of potatoes and i tell them 2 potatoes are missing from the bag, they say thats fine and sign the receipt....2 days later they phone me and say "there wasnt enough potatoes in that bag im going to trading standards unless i get a refund!!!" this is the same kind of thing in my opinion...

Aradam i am not saying your out for money, and i do sympathise with your problem but i also look at things from the other side. If you sold me your car and i came and paid you and drove away, i then took the car to holland and back and also carried out some part replacements myself ( no matter how easy) after 4/5 months i phone you up and say i want my money back what would you do? would you just pay up happily? If you have concrete evidence that the car was faulty at the time of purchase and the dealer knew this then you may have a case, otherwise i think your just being very hopefull.

What are the solid facts that the car was faulty at time of purchase? and why would you put a car into a garage for an oil change but not an air filter change?

Changing glowplugs and airfilter and maybe other things he hasnt told us about is certainly not routine maitenance, He has said he is no expert with cars yet took on the job himself. Why on earth didnt the garage that did the oil change not do a full service or at least point out that they needed doing? this whole story sounds very fishy to me and although the dealer should have replied i really dont think you have any case for a refund.

You have admitted in this thread that you are not an expert with cars? and you went ahead and did mechanical repairs yourself on the car? changing air filter and glowplugs and whatever else you have done, you have also driven the car to the netherlands and back, In my opinion you are entitled to no compensation and to just expect the dealer to hand you a wedge of cash because your car has developed faults 5 months after you bought it and several 000's of miles and not forgetting your own possibly botched handyman jobs is laughable.

So what your saying is i would have to list every fault that is possible with the car and even then if something else was to go wrong they would be entitled to compensation? even though they had full knowledge prior to purchase that the car had numerous faults and they have signed a receipt accepting so...

The thing is here im not trying to "get out" of anything, i have a car that has problems, i do not want to put the car right but somebody else might be happy to do that, so i am selling it to them quite clearly for "spares or repair". Also im selling it well under its true value to compensate for any work required. What i want to know is from a legal point of view exactly what the law states here, i cant seem to get a straight answer from anyone i speak to, all i get is opinions. I honestly dont see how the buyer can complain about a car bought in need of repair but can they???

Hi guys , Thanks for the replies, this seems like a really tough subject, basically if i have a car thats traded in or from whatever other source, if i feel the car has problems ( maybe nothing major ) it is much easier to just sell it as "spares or repair" and i am making the buyer aware that the car has some problems. I am not hiding anything, and the buyer has full access to inspect the car prior to sale to make their own mind up as to whether they want to buy it or not. I just want to know how this affects the buyer legally, for example i sell mr bloggs a 2004 vectra listed as "spares or repair" the car has mot and still drives but has electrical faults and the engine management light is on. The book price is say £4000 i sell the car "spares or repair for £1500, mr bloggs examines the car and pays up and drives off into the sunset. 1 week later mr bloggs comes back and says the car was not as he expected and wants his money back. This is just an example of a "spares or repair" situation and i wonder where the legal point of view is on this. Thanks again for any help..

Hi all, I recently sold a car on ebay ( i am a business seller) i listed the car as "spares or repair" as it was a trade in and i had no real idea as to how good the car was, even though it drove ok and had mot i was sure it had various problems so i listed it as "spares or repair" to sort of cover myself. Now my question is this, does the purchaser of this vehicle have any rights to bring the car back to me if they are not happy? or do i have to list every known fault with the car? just wondered how it stands with the SOGA when you sell a car as "spares or repair". Thanks for any views..