Please give your support to the Farepak Victims http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/18820 On the 13th October it will be 5 years since the collapse of Farepak. The Farepak Victims Committee call on the Government to: 1. Bring those responsible to account 2. Fully compensate Farepak Victims 3. Put in place financial regulations that ensure that this never happens again. You can also following FVC on Twitter and/or Facebook http://twitter.com/#!/LouiseMcDaid http://www.facebook.com/groups/285468791482270/301830659846083/?notif_t=group_activity A number of media people have supported it including Martin Lewis of MoneySavingsExpertForum

Have you seen this? http://www.ukuncut.org.uk/ It seems interesting..... a bail IN. You have to watch the video.....

So can it be recorded with CRA as anything else then? Incase I may have mis-understood the problem in terms of being recorded at CRA. Now as far as I beleive the person wants to take it to court as the bank are refusing to try and remove it, therefore do they have a case and how would they fight it? Going on what I've been told it's been recorded as a default.

A default was recorded on the loan at CRA of which a full and final settlement was agreed with the bank. They didn't realise this would happen, however, I do recognise they did default. Please keep in mind this is a bit of a remote situation to me so I don't know all the details but I am trying to learn about CRA's etc. I know more about Insolvency but this is of interest to me too. Basically, I'm learning, that is what I'm saying.

Someone having a cash flow problem as most of it is tied up in assets and comes to an agreement with the bank to repay loan at reduced payments. A reduced amount in total of the loan is repaid. The person didn't think their credit score would be affected in doing this but finds out differently. Out of interest is there anyway the situation can be resolved? I suspect not but thought I'd see if anyone else has a different opinion.

Hiya! I noticed when I received my recent clubcard vouchers they was some offer on that you could use your vouchers at Topps Tiles. I'm sure it was for more than the price of the voucher..... as they do sometimes. So if you do the points then it might be worth holding onto your Tesco vouchers. The offer is until June time. Another batch of vouchers are due out just before June.

Thank you for the warm welcome and will assist if I'm able to help. I've now managed to understand the issue I came on with now...... and it's all now down to some letter writing and Monday's postal system.

I think pop_gun means creditors.

I beleive you do have to make sure the company is solvent to petition the court otherwise your paying money for nothing. Pop_gun, also, just to clear up something I've noticed in a couple of your postings. A companies Debtors owe the company money, as they are in debt to the company . The companies creditors owe the company money (suppliers, loan, mortgage etc), hence a creditors winding up petiton etc. Basically, your debtors owe YOU money and you owe your creditors money.

Thankyou. I looked up Ofgem after I posted and then realised. Thanks for all your help and everyone else who contributed to the discussion of which I have enjoyed. Good to thrash it out and get to the nitty gritty. Will keep you all posted with hopefully a future update. and..... thanks again. Miss Vin.

Nottslad, when you say I have good grounds for a complaint, do you mean to Ofgem or are you talking about Scottish Gas? A complaint to Ofgem sounds like more fun to me. If so anything specific you think I should mention or add etc apart from putting in the complaint? Pointers etc, that you might see as being of greater prominence? Finally, will there be any money in this complaint for me? Ok, I'm being a chancer now but the thought sounds good!

Slight problem, I'm not sure if my.... contract.... is an express contract or an implied contract. Do you have anything that relates to implied contract? Express contracts means terms of the agreement are in writing. And it is a contractual term specifically stated to be part of the contract. Implied contract means the duties and obligation of both parties are not expressed but are implied by their acts or conducts. Both indicate by their conduct that they have a mutual agreement and need not express the agreement in words. I do get letters re express but on the other hand I would say it's an implied contract. Oh, so sorry, just reading it again, I seem to be getting myself confused now. It is an implied but that is ok re your last posting Nottslad.

As by definition the terms and conditions of a deemed contract have not been expressly agreed between suppliers and customers, Ofgem considers that it is appropriate for these terms and conditions to be subject to regulation Correct, and therefore that is industry regulation and NOT company regulation. It's basically the Utilities Act 2000 etc. Basically what I have been saying in latter posts. Oh, where did you get all that info..... so, so, so, goooooooooooooood! Thankyou, thankyou!!! I almost don't want the discussion to end..... You need to tell me the source, so I can print it off and go and smack Scottish Gas over the head with it!!!! lol! Miss Vin

Good for you miromike. You never know with all that extra dosh you might be able to bag yourself a girlfriend to treat now. Sorry your just a bit old for me though. :wink:

Ok fair enough. I totally agree that in Contract Law you don't have to sign a contract for terms and conditions to apply (like getting on a bus or a train etc.) but I have been of the feeling like the previous poster has stated that I haven't actually used their service and therefore I do think it's questionable as to the existance of the contract? I am not using the gas and therefore there is no contractual relationship there. Normally something... happens..... for a contract to exist and nothing on my side would technically form a contract. They might have rights to access meter and legally have to send me a bill but the fact that I'm not doing anything that would form a contract is questionable. I'm not subject to a standing charge so the standing charge arguement doesn't apply to me. I do appreciate you know the regularity regulations but I do think that you might not be accounting for the ins and outs of contract law. However, we will just say we agree there is a deemed contract but this still doesn't mean their terms and conditons automatically apply to me, as like has been said, my activities as "customer" no contractual relationship has been formed re usage of supply which is shut off. On that note what would happen if someone didn't pay there bill and they took the customer to court to gain means to access the meter, as threatened in final demand. Now what would happen then if customer wasn't paying? Would they not just shut the supply off? Or would they just keep billing a customer who is not paying bills? That would be interesting to know Nottslad. I am slightly concerned that your going by the regulations but failing to account for other area's of law that can throw up questions, however, I am very appreciative for your help too.

Yes, but a contract can be formed in a number of ways. I have never signed documentation and agreed to their terms and conditions like there other customers and agreed on giving meter readings. I have never done this. However, I am not disputing a contract exists by the box being there and them being supplier. An unwritten contract may exist, however, not in quite the same way as their signed up customers. I have never agreed to their terms and conditions but like I have said I am not disputing a contract exists by the box just being there. Anyway, as Ofgem states it is the Gas Companies responsibility to read the meter and it's NOT mine. All they are doing is keeping themselves legally correct by reading the meter, however I don't understand why they just can't stick to the once every 18 months as they did before. Nottslad, this could be legally disputed in court..... this is a bit of grey area and not as cut and dried as your making out. You do seem to come out on the energy companies side all the time and no balance in your arguements, why?

Ok, sorry about the 2 above postings but I'm just needing to put a link up. Right, I've looked it up and the following ofgem link conforms with the Utilities Act 2000. As you can see from page 40 onwards it is the gas companies responsibility to read the meter. What you have put above is just company rules and I NEVER entered into a contract with SG and therefore I am not subject to these rules in quite the same way. By law though, I do have to give them access to read live meter. That I am not disputing. Plus there is NO supply of gas to my property, it is just a live meter. http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:zQPcIW6idbsJ:www.ofgem.gov.uk/Networks/Techn/Metrolgy/AssetMgmt/MR/Documents1/Meter%2520Reader%2520Guidance%2520Notes.pdf+Who+is+responsible+for+reading+gas+meter&hl=en&gl=uk&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESgSAbVmdVX0c2SaEubIULbofj6VgVljOkH656r8VhC3wEmOT6FNa9E7pvq8wP-KvzMCTQnk7L8kFUo3nkrtHOO9UGTYXDdHRFcX7NMcBaPChxK3lV8ncIgzbHQGM-qP6j9q8Je9&sig=AHIEtbTDzSA5S63pBWpg4Ci2G29-QWNyuw Thankyou for giving me the Act as that is what I was needing, something a bit solid other than company rules. As I was really needing to know what my rights were.

Sorry abot this, it's just so I can put a link up

ok

I don't think I'm disputing the fact of not having signed a contract but what I am disputing is it my responsibility to read the meter? As far as I beleive no. I find it veryyyyyyyyyyy strange a company can send a demand a final one at that to go to court on an ESTIMATE bill. That is just crazy!!!!! You'd think they'd check the facts out first. If I end up in court so be it. Please keep in mind, I do not have a land line and when I phoned from my mobile their freephone number it cost me £6. I am not refusing them access to the meter and I will certainly not be contacting the council to get the meter out although you are right in what you say about that. Also, I certainly wouldn't like to think I was accommodating a company that makes millions by saving them money and buying a key. No no, I just not that type of person. They take me to court and cost themselves money if they so wish. Really not my issue if they can't sort their computer system out to put something saying that I don't have a running gas supply into my home and just check the meter once every 18 months as their operator stated. If they want me to check the meter in between then I think they can just take a run and jump.

Buying the key isn't the issue but I just don't see why should inconvenienced just to save SG money. Phoning their freephone num from my mobile costs me a fortune and it means I have go to a phone box and have the hassle of phoning them up. Now don't get me wrong, I know that isn't hard work but I have other things to do with my time other than possibly phone them up every 3 to 6 months just to save them from sending a gas man out. They make a fortune so I'm really not concerned about trying to save them money. This is just a joke though as this is the first I've heard of it in 6 years. Why all of a sudden is what gets me? Oh, I guess I better stop as I'm starting to feel like I'm ranting..... oh dear...

I'm not going to be able to help you here but just out interest..... Does your mum have a similar name to you or could anyone else have used your name at that address? Just curious.

Hello Martin, I think I have already said the gas meter is on the outside of the house and therefore they are free to access the meter anytime themselves. I don't think I will hassle myself with buying a key as, as you've said it's NOT my responsibility to read the meter and it is theirs. Access would never be an issue even if the box was inside, I am not not denying them access in anyway what-so-ever. Certainly not going to nrbuying a key as I don't see why I should but like I've said they are free to access the meter 24/7 if they wish. Think I will write them a letter as you say. Still going to refuse to give my name. I will just reply from The Occupier. Also, thank you to Mattlamb and Surfer for replies. All replies have been helpful and at least I now know a little bit more about it all. Having said that though, I wouldn't have an issue facing them court if they so wished.

Hello Surfer and thanks for replyiing. The supply is switched off. There is no running gas into the house. To clear up any confusion, when they read the meter then they get the correct reading and my "bills" come through as 00.00. as no gas has been used. However, when they resort to the estimate bills then I get all kinds of amounts and it's the £400 estimate bill that they have issued a final demand and court action on. I 've just searched the net there and I see that British Gas but known in Scotland as Scottish Gas abolished standing charges in April 2000 and all customers were then charge per unit usage only. This would explain 00.00 bills. Therefore, so as you have said it is their responsibility to read the meter and not mine if it's on the outside of the house? Is that correct?

But did Lombard put an agreement to transfer into writing?