Hi guys, sorry, the first half of this post has disappeared. My second question is basically, is it worth sending Vanquis an SAR because they are likely to have made punitive charges and penalties when my card went into default. This is with a view to claiming them back. Thanks, Mikey_L

Jeezman, It would be very ungracious of me to complain that someone had 'jumped in' on a thread I started. But there's a reason that the wise ones recommend starting your own thread for your own questions. I think these are: 1. The chances are that there will be many many posts before you reach a point where the forum ceases to be useful or you have nothing to contribute. 2. The flow of posts related to the original poster gets blocked when others jump in with their own stuff. And this thread is no longer attracting the responses I desperately need. I am actually trying to avoid bankruptcy. So perhaps I'll start another thread?

Hi vint1954, No nothing received since. The full balance is £12,000 so they'll have to wait. The DMP amount will be paid to them until they say otherwise.

The DN says: "In order to remedy this breach we must receive a payment of by 21 December 2009" Your account balance is currently ". Thanks

I've been told by the org I'm setting up a DMP with that MBNA have declined because the 'debt has been transferred'. Guess that means they've sold it on to a DCA. Could anyone advise if these people might be amenable to payments through a DMP. I understand it's always better to deal with original creditors. I'm paying all I can afford and have few assets so the DCA wouldn't gain advantage by getting a CCJ etc.

Hi, If anybody could suggest something re the above that would be great. Thanks, Mikey

Well, I sent them the dispute letter - template above - and they have responded, which did surprise me a little. They suggest that my objections are not well founded because the copy (another enclosed) "clearly contained all the terms and conditions which were legally prescribed at the time it was executed". They also include an information sheet which basically gives some answers to possible questions like 'how can I be satisfied the agreement was properly executed', And presents an answer which assures how seriously MBNA takes its obligations and how perfect the agreements are! Would be greatful for any ideas on how to keep the challenge going - see my earlier post for links to scans of the agreement. Legibility has been mentioned as an issue. I'm trying to dispute becuase MBNA have declined my DMP because the 'debt has been transferred'. Have yet to hear from the DCA and I will post about that in due course no doubt. Thanks

I hope this is not a battle - I've been with them for donkeys without any problems and the borrowing I have is at good rates. However, I'm trying now to set up a DMP and wonder how amenable they will be, I've had mixed responses from them so far - offers of help that I'm not sure are sincere. Prior to the DMP process (through a debt charity) I wrote to them offering reduced payments but they have responded saying they want the letter signed. Should I? I have discover that dealing with MBNA has made me a bit paranoid and is probably not helping my relationship with creditors who might be more reasonable. I need to sort that out.

This happened to me - it's a stinker. So I wrote to them likewise and they on 'appeal' refunded the charges. I had gone O/D as a result of paying the Business card DD and didn't spot it. But I did have a long history with them with no probs so don't know if that helped.

I'm astonished? I have recently started the process of setting up a DMP. Total creditor £34K of which Crap One (is that right?!) is less than £500. A fraction of the total. But - they've written to say that following my request to set up a DMP they are issuing a Default Notice. And that is what they have done! I have never missed a payment with them nor paid less than the minimum before the DMP. But the DMP request has triggered a DN. I think I'm offering £15 per month instead of £25! And the Direct Debit is still operating this month! It's a bit frustrating really because the minimum was relatively low and I could have afforded it - but had to be fair to the other creditors. Which include MBNA at extortionate interest rates. Is there anything to gain by requesting the CCA? Nothing to lose that's for sure.

Thanks Gaz. I read elsewhere that MBNA tend to Default and sell on after say 7 months irrespective, and that time scale would be about right with me too. I need to rememeber to put what I want first and think in terms of what outcome is best for me. And to take it one step at a time. I have written offering reduced payments and am also trying to set up a DMP through a debt charity.

Hi, I'd appreciate any thoughts on the above. MBNA have gone very quiet - I haven't heard anything since the DN (although Xmas intervened). To me that doesn't bode well but I have written to them offering reduced payments.

Thanks for responses. The date of the Default Notice (21 Dec) has mow passed so I'm preparing myself to hear more in the New Year. I have written to MBNA twice making an offer of reduced monthly payments leading to a DMP. I'm offering 70% of the minimum payment. I have also sent them a schedule of what I'm also offering to my other creditors. The amount I have for creditors is 1/3 of my take home pay (rent is another 1/3) so they can see there isn't any more available. I'm trying to arrange a DMP and am finalising my budget this week. I should mention I wish to make repayments of what credit I have had but I am not willing to accept grossly inflated interest and threats nor pay more than I can afford. I have also sent them a letter disputing the CCA I received. I know this doesn't really bode well for negotiation but I felt I had to try and challenge the DN somehow. I am advised that the Default Notice is not correct re dates/notice. How do they manage to get these wrong?? Is anyone able to give me an idea of MBNA's likely action at this point? From reading other threads there seems not to be a pattern. Will they go for a CCJ or sell the debt on I wonder? Balance owing is £12K and I have no assets to speak of. Does this make them more likely to accept reduced payments than if the balance was smaller? Thanks

I sent them the dispute letter re the dodgy CCA. My experience previously is that sending a dispute letter is followed by a wave of activity from them. But I also sent an offer of payments. I had trouble getting my head round it as it seems very contradictory. But I don't think normal rules of communication apply with MBNA. I think what I'm saying is that I'm up for responding to threats and challenging unfair practise and interest rates. But i also want to pay them.

Thanks. This is great. But it feels a little tricky because I am hoping to negotiate with them regarding a DMP perhaps. But I guess establishing the enforceability of the CCA is essential as it affects what they can do.

Thanks Vint1954 I haven't tried negotiating with them. Firstly because previously I've tried hard to do so and not got very far apart from agreeing a temp reduction in interest (down from 34%!). But I have taken advice regarding a DMP and notified them of this. I'm in the process of trying to get the paperwork sorted for this. Also MBNA are aware I have other creditors and I didn't expect them to agree a reduction without knowing that I was asking the others too. Do you think its worth approaching them directly rather than a DMP? Thanks.

Hi, This is a new thread as things have changed since the previous one and time moved on. Previously I have posted and received some great help about the trials of getting MBNA to respond to my numerous letters and CCA request. I have now got the CCA: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/mbna/237923-mbna-cca-comments-please.html but the update is that I have now received a Default Notice from them. The key points in the DN are: Dated: 4 Dec Received 9 Dec Date to comply: by 21 Dec Is this notice period OK (I'm reading different things)? Overall strategy with them is that I am looking to make repayments but unhappy about excessive interest and charges and don't want it to go on for ever. There are other unsecured creditors too - total £35K of which MBNA is £12K. I can afford 70% of minimum repayments - say 700 per month - (am working on a budget) and hope that a DMP would work. I don't mind 4 or 5 years if that's what it takes. I am also prepared for Bankruptcy. I'd much rather not but will do so if it's the best remaining option. As ever, any helpful comments much appreciated.

Hi, I would appreciate comments on the CCA I have received from MBNA. It dates from 2004 and I'm fairly happy the signature is mine. I'm at the point of them just having issued a Default Notice after several reduced payments, so things are moving up a gear. The original is a bit tricky to read although I don't think it could be described as illegible. A magnifying glass solves the problem. The CCA took so long to arrive I was hoping they didn't have one! It consists of 2 pages which I have called front and back. Each of these they copied onto a sheet of A4. Looks like original was a tear off bottom of letter printed front and back. http://i929.photobucket.com/albums/ad134/Mikey_London2/MBNACCABackpage.png http://i929.photobucket.com/albums/ad134/Mikey_London2/MBNACCAFrontpage.png Thanks, Mikey_London

I agree lots of 'may' and hot air but a nasty company too. My understanding is that they cannot begin recovery through court without having first issued a default notice. They may then proceed through court to obtain a County Court Judgement against you. As part of the the judge will consider how the money can be repaid. The judge will not force you to pay more than you can afford and that 'should' be the regular payment you are already making. Things can get difficult if you fail to make a payment agreed by the court following a CCJ. The creditor can then apply to take other steps including bailiffs, attachment of earnings and/or charging order. I may not be precise in my explanation but the key is that MBNA cannot do anything without permission of the court. And the real problems can start if you miss a payment ordered by the court but you can hopefully trust that the judge has been fair and only asked for what is affordable. MBNA write in a way which ignores the due process of the court and try to give the impression all they have to do is ring up the court and it will do what they want with you having no rights at all. MBNA have a very poor reputation and my experience with them supports that.

Err, the agreement dates from 2004 and the credit limit has been increased several times and more than quadrupled. The wrote to say so when this was done. I haven't seen any updated agreement - but is the first I have heard of this requirement. I think they have sent stuff about changes to terms, certainly interest rates.

Hi, No I don't see that it does. Not in the body of the agreement. It came accompanied with a covering letter assuring me that it was fully legal and a set orf revised T&Cs, and a computer print of my online application (e.g. other credit cards).

I'm back now! I had been making minimum payment to creditors for the last few months including MBNA who reduced the interest (temporarily) which made them more affordable. Except the payments weren't affordable and I have started making reduced again. It's unfortunate but, due to the fact that contacting MBNA promptly last time made absolutely no difference to their behaviour I haven't had any dialogue and am considering my options. Up to and including bankruptcy but I don't want that and would prefer to pay them all off over 4 or 5 years. I can afford 75% of minimum payments overall. But, today (9 Dec) received a default notice from MBNA (dated 4 Dec) and giving 21 Dec as date arrears should be cleared. I have a CCA which looks similar to others posted in the library here. Any suggestions of action by me (or them) appreciated. I'm trying a DMP first and have written to tell them so. Starting to miss minimum payments with other creditors. MBNA arrears £1K, balance £11K. And I have no assets to speak of.

My point was that I didn't consider the DIY route to be free; not free in terms of actual cost, cost in ways other than financial, nor free in terms of opportunity cost. I would be interested to hear how much time others invest in dealing with, for example, companies such as MBNA. By the time they have chased the CCA and applied for a subject access request (after familiarising themselves of what that was and whether they needed to make one) many hours will have passed. And what about the Civil Procedure Rules? Copying and pasting a letter doesn't take long but I trust we agree there is rather more too it than that. So I think we're in agreement on that then? I battled with MBNA over a few months in both pursuing a complaint and finally getting my CCA. Please don't tell me there was no cost. Apart from noting the obvious difficulty of chosing a reputable CMC I made no assumptions about quality of service or the financial risks involved. So I'm grateful to the previous 2 posters for apearing to respond to points I didn't make. For what its worth, I would only consider a CMC if it came with a strong recommendation and the fees were reasonable. With a credit card balance of £10K I would seriously consider paying a few hundred to get that wiped - if I had it. But my preference is to go it alone too.

Many posters seem to hold strong views about paying CMCs when we can do the work ourslves 'for free'. One comment suggested that those who didn't do the work themselves were simply 'lazy'. I find that incredibly naive Free of what exactly? Presumably money, certainly not stress. Trying to get a CCA from MBNA has cost me a several hundred pounds if I were to put a price on the time involved and the stress. Even Special delivery comes at a cost. The templates on this site are excellent - but spending half a weekend editing them to meet my needs and managing the paper trail is not my idea of fun. As for deciding which CMC to use - if any - that's another matter. Clearly they can make inflated claims - such as 80% of CCAs being unenforceable. But it's possible to unrealistically get your hopes up gain that in these forums...

I'll post it as soon as I can sort out my scanner. Its similar to an example posted in the MBNA agreements 'library' which is appears enforceable. Yes the signature is there - and the prescribed terms. I wanted to check out regarding the signature and penalty fees and whether they should be on the same page. Something I read said they must.