Firstly, thank you all for your replies. The managed loan is on a 96 months/8 yrs repayments. First payment being 01 May 2006, so the final installment should be 01 April 2014. When given the agreement to sign (the banks copy), we were asked to check our names and address, and the loan amount, she (branch manager) then flipped it through to the third page for us to sign. We were then given our unsigned copies (total 5 pages x 2 copies). We should have throughly read every single lines but she was rushing us and we were still very frustrated and upset with her for selling us the useless PPI for our personal loan (even though she was aware that we were self employed). Just wanted to sign the paper, get it done with and go home. Oh, another thing that the branch manager told us was, after basically saying that PPI for our personal loan was in fact useless, the managed loan was our best option because (among all her other reasons) 1. we were self employed and 2. it does not require us to purchase a PPI to be approved. Below are the copy of the loan agreement. Looking at it now (the agreement) makes me wonder how we managed to get ourselves hooked into signing for the managed loan at the first place. To be honest, we have not got any clue how it works and the agreement doesn't help at all... very confusing.. We don't know what we will end up with because we were not given the total loan amount inc interest. Saying that, according to the agreement, our total interest using their 'simple' rate is actually more than 50% of our pricipal loan. The managed loan was supposed to help us get our finances in order but it has messed us up big time. Anyway, here are our copy of the agreement (first three pages). Page 1 - Page 2- Page 3 - Will sent the CCA request letter first thing tomorrow. Whats next if the banks copy of the loan agreement has the same error? (Considering that she did print three sets of the same agreement, 1 each for us and 1 for the bank) But, the big question is, what if the banks copy, the one which we signed, has the correct final payment date? About the PPI, could do with more research and advice before charging at them with full force Warm regards, Natz

Hi, We took up a loan with HSBC (managed loan). The branch manager gladly offered us the managed loan to consolidate our credit cards and personal loan, saying that it was the only option and the best option for us to get our finances sorted. To be honest, it got us deeper into the realm of debts, it was the start of more charges and OD. It was partly HSBC fault that brought us to the managed loan option. If we knew what we know now, we would not even consider the managed loan. I've just noticed an error on our unsigned copies of credit/loan agreement (2 copies due to joint loan with my partner). Our monthly repayments started on 01 May 2006, but on both copies of the credit agreement stated that a final payment for the loan payable on 02 April 2006 (before the existance of our loan). Does that mean that the credit/loan agreement has been 'improperly executed' or simply doesn't exist (the agreement)? Another thing that I found out while sorting out the bank documents (and thanks to this forum), HSBC has mis-sold us the PPI for our personal loan in 2004. When the loan was taken, both my partner and I were self employed (still am). Come to think of it, the branch manager who sold us the PPI knew of our employment status. She was fully aware that the PPI won't do us any good but she still sold it to us. When we were there to get our finances sorted last year (and she offered us the managed loan to pay off our personal loan and OD), we first requested for one month repayment holiday for the personal loan. When she refuses our request, we asked about the PPI (which we have been paying since 2004) and what could that do to help us, but we were told (by she whom had sold us the PPI) that it doesn't apply to us because we were still self employed and not unemployed. Even then we would need a letter from the job center to proof that we were unemployed and was job seeking. Didn't know much about our legal rights, we were still self employed and not unemployed. Anyway, we know the deal now, only need the right direction/s on whats next with regards to the incorrect date on the loan agreement and the mis-sold PPI. Warm Regards, Natz

Hi Wickerman, Many thanks for your reply. I received a reply from HSBC for my letter dated 29/11. They were asking me to write to them again with a specific breakdown detailing the amount, dates and specific charges types in question, then they will consider my request for the refund. I have sent them a total of 3 letters including LBA. All the letters were sent with the schedule of charges. It looks like they are just trying to buy more time for themselves. I am not sure of how to reply to them but one thing for sure I will include in my reply that I am very aware of what they are trying to do. What is the status of your claim? I really do hope that you will have a smoother claim than I. Best regards, Natz

First prelim they replied (after 4 weeks) and asked me to give them up to 4 weeks to investigate the matter. Within that time I was charged another 2x. So I sent the second prelim letter on the 13/11 with a new schedule which have the new charges, making the total £963.64 (giving them another 2 weeks before LBA). The second prelim with the new charges will end on 28/11. I received two letters from HSBC re my business account (after I sent the second prelim), asking me to repay the overdraft in full. First letter was for me to pay in 7 days (which I ignored) and the second letter which I received this morning demanding me to pay within 10 days. They have the nerve to demand me to pay in full when they have not even reply to my second prelim letter . Or I would assume these demands are responds to my second prelim letter to them. At this stage the total unauthorised OD is £955.71, all due to their charges. And I am now reclaiming total £1063.64 plus interest. First prelim they replied and asked me to give them up to 4 weeks to investigate the matter. Within that time I was charged another 2x. I sent the second prelim letter on the 13/11 with a new schedule which have the new charges (giving them another 2 weeks before LBA). The second prelim with the new charges will end on 28/11. Now they have charged me again. The questions are: 1. Are they allowed to demand payment from me for the OD in full while I am reclaiming my charges from them? (Mind you , over the years they did not say anything until I sent my first prelim). 2. How do I write the LBA to include the letters which they have sent me demanding me to to pay in full for the OD, include the new charges and remind them that I am still making a claim over unfair charges? Oh, one more thing, on both demand letters, they even suggested that I take up a loan with them to repay the OD. I would like to thank you in advance for your kind assistance. Best regards, Natz

Hi Wickerman, How is your progress with the HSBC business account? I am in a very confusing situation at the moment and was hoping that you could assist. I received two letters from HSBC re my business account, asking me to repay the overdraft. First letter was for me to pay in 7 days (which I ignored) and the second letter which I received this morning demanding me to pay within 10 days. They have the nerve to demand me to pay in full when they have not even reply to my second prelim letter .At this stage the total unauthorised OD is £955.71, all due to their charges. And I am now reclaiming £1063.64 plus interest. First prelim they replied and asked me to give them up to 4 weeks to investigate the matter. Within that time I was charged another 2x. I sent the second prelim letter on the 13/11 with a new schedule which have the new charges (giving them another 2 weeks before LBA). The second prelim with the new charges will end on 28/11. The question are: 1. Are they allowed to demand payment from me for the OD in full while I am reclaiming my charges from them? (Mind you , over the years they did not say anything until I sent my first prelim). 2. How do I write the LBA to include the letters which they have sent me demanding me to to pay in full for the OD, include the new charges and remind them that I am still making a claim over unfair charges? I would like to thank you in advance for your kind assistance. Best regards, Natz

Posted the rejection letter above and received reply that Barclaycard is sticking to their offer of £168. I accepted it as part settlement and will persue the remainder. Got my statement today and the £168 has been cerdited to my account even though I told them I would prefer to be paid by cheque. Should I write to Barclay and insist to be paid by cheque? They also reduced my credit limit after they credited the £168 saying that the decision has been based on my overall account usage and the way I manage my account. (Ratbags! Apart from once or twice going a little bit over my credit limit, I paid regularly and I was never in default.) They are getting back at me for asking my charges back. But I am still submitting a claim tonight for the remainder plus interest via moneyclaim... Saying that, to be honest, I am a bit nervous. Have not got the slightest idea what to put on the claim.. Any suggestions/tips/advices will be greatly appreciated. Also, do I claim Barclaycard or Barclays Bank PLC ?

Double wow... That is indeed a very fast reply. I will go and read the FAQ about making a claim, I am going to read each and every paragraphs slowly and carefully so that I won't make any mistake when making the claim. Then on Monday 02/10, HSBC here I come... (feeling very nervous) Many thanks again closey.

Can someone please help!!!! Received a letter from HSBC in respond to my LBA (14 days ends on Tuesday 02/10). Attached to the reply is a full response note of how to discuss the concern further , address for the Service quality team and also a paragraph saying that if complains cannot resolve, it will be refred to the Financial Ombudsman. And also according to the letter, my complaint can now be considered resolved. What should I do now??? Do I reply to the letter, if so, what do I say?? Or should just stick to my gun and file for the moneyclaim when the 14 days is up (which is on 02/10)? HSBC is making me confuse when they say that it only applies to credit cards. Please, somebody, anybody, please help !!!!! This is what it says: Dear blablabla Thank you for your recent letter concerning charges applied to your account. I am sorry you have had cause to complain. We do not agree with your contention that the charges have been imposed by the Bank constitute a penalty clause and are therefore unenforceable. I would also advice you that the Office of Fair Trading report of 5 April 2006 concerned credit card accounts only. The contract between the bank and it's customer is governed by HSBC's standard Terms & Conditions. In respect of unauthorised overdrafts, the relevant clauses are 7.11 to 7.18. In these circumstances, there is a process that involves the Bank considering whether or not to pay the item. A fee is payable for this and the fee are set out in the public price lists We enclose a copy of the relevant Terms & Conditions and a copy of the latest price list for you information. Thank you once again for taking the time to bring your concern to the bank's attention. I am sorry it was necessary for you to do so. I hope that matters have now been resolved to your satisfaction. However, should this not be the case, the attached guidance sheet explains the next step available to you. Yours sincerely, Mrs A A Phillips ..............................

I am rejecting to Barclaycard offer of settlement which is less than half of what I am claiming. Will only accept the £180 offered as part settlement. Can someone please have a look at my respond before I send it off to them. I have doctored the template to suit my situation. Any suggestion and advice will be greatly appreciated. Response to settlement offer Dear Madam, ACCOUNT NUMBER : xxxxxxxxxx I thank you for your letter of 25th September 2006 ( Your Reference: xxxxxxx ). However, whilst I appreciate your swift reply your offer to partially refund the amount owed is unsatisfactory. I respectfully decline your offer of settlement and request, once again, that you return to me all charges imposed on this account, totalling £363.73 I will accept the sum of £168.00 offered only as part settlement and on the clear understanding that I will pursue the remainder of £195.73, with a County Court claim if necessary. I look forward to the receipt of the above amount in part settlement and I would prefer payment via cheque made payable to xxxxxxx You state that the OFT recommended a fee of £12.00. This is incorrect, I suggest that you study the report in more detail, Below is an extract from an OFT Press Release reference number 68/06 dated 5th April 2006: "Where credit card default charges are set at more than £12, the OFT will presume that they are unfair, and is likely to challenge the charge unless there are limited, exceptional business factors in play. A default charge is not fair simply because it is below £12." The press release also goes on to say: “A default charge should only be used to recover certain limited administrative costs.” Perhaps you will study the press release and maybe take advice from your legal department. The press release is available online at Current credit card default charges unfair . If you do not comply fully and unconditionally within 14 days then I shall begin a claim against you for the full amount £363.73 plus 8% interest plus my costs and without further notice. Yours faithfully,

Many thanks Wickerman, I will be posting the prelim letter tomorrow. I shall keep you posted on my progress. Best of luck to you too. Best regards, Natz

Hi Wickerman, I am also claiming for refund of charges applied to my sole trader business account with HSBC. I have received my copy statements and have calculated all the charges . And I will be sending a prelim letter requesting the refund (after I figure out which preliminary letter to use). Do I use the preliminary letter for personal accounts from the library? Or are there another preliminary letter specifically for business accounts? Another question if you don't mind me asking, do you calculate and put the contractual interest of 25.08% in you preliminary letter? Many thanks in advance. Any advice and assistance will be greatly appreciated. Best regards, Natz

Wow, many thanks closey for the very fast and straight forward reply. Much appreciated I will go to royal mail website now and request for the proof of delivery. Many thanks again, Natz

I received a letter from HSBC in respond to the LBA which I sent on 18/09/2006. Apparently they did not receive my prelim letter but according to Royal Mail (posted on 01/09/2006 via first class recorded delivery) the letter was received on 04/09/2006, the same day as Halifax. Here is what the letter say: Our Ref blablabla Dear blabla Your reference blablabla Thank you for your letter dated 18 September 2006 concerning the recent correspondence, which we do not appear to have received, and the points you raise. I am looking into the matters you have raised and will contact you with a full response as soon as I have completed my investigations. In the meantime, I enclose a copy of our leaflet which explains how these matter are dealt with. If you do need to contact us, please quote reference number xxxxxxxxxx. Yours sincerely David L Johnson Customer Services Officer ......................................... Now I am a little confuse. 1. I addressed both prelim and LBA letters to a Mr M Bowden HSBC customer Service Manager in Sheffield. 2. According to Royal mail, the prelim letter was delivered to HSBC and was signed for on the 04/09/2006 but HSBC say we do not have it. 3. On the leaflet it say that if 8 weeks have passed since the matter first raised then we have the right to refer the case to the Financial Ombudsman services. My questions: 1. Does the 14 days for the LBA still stands while they are investigating what happen to the prelim letter? 2. Has anyone received this kind of reply/respond for their LBA? 3. What if they take more than 14 days, do I proceed with the next step and file a claim against HSBC? 4. Should I get the proof of delivery from Royal mail and forward it to HSBC to proof that they did received and signed for it? Many thanks for taking the time to answer my questions. All advices and assistance will be greatly appreciated. Best regards, Natz

14 days up but still no sign of neither the forms to sign nor the money. I am still unsure if I should send the LBA to them because they did verbally agreed to refund me. I rephrased the LBA and mentioned the phone call. Could someone please tell me if this is okay. Just want to make sure that there are no mistakes. Many thanks in advance. Best regards, Natz .......................... LETTER BEFORE ACTION On September 7th 2006 I was delighted to receive a telephone call from your department informing me that you have agreed to refund the charges which you have been taking from my account for the past five years. The person I spoke to told me you would be sending me the relevant forms to sign and then the money would be transferred to my account. It is now over 14 days since you received (and confirmed receipt on 04/09/2006) of my first letter which was posted on 01/09/2006. I have not received any forms from yourselves or any correspondence whatsoever with regards to the funds you have agreed to reimburse me. I now understand that the regime of 'fees' which you have been applying to my account in relation to direct debit refusals, exceeding overdraft limits and so forth are unlawful at Common Law, Statute and recent Consumer regulations. I would draw your attention to the terms of the contract which you agreed to at the time that I opened my account. It is an implied term of that contract that you would conduct yourselves lawfully and in a manner which complies with UK law. I am frankly shocked that you have operated my account in this way as I had always reposed confidence in your integrity and expertise as my fiduciary. I calculate that you have taken a total of £444.00 . I am enclosing a copy of the schedule of the charges which I am claiming. I have already sent you a copy of this in my original letter of the 01/09/2006. I require repayment in full of this money. If you do not comply fully within 14 days then I shall begin a claim against you for the full amount plus interest, plus my costs, without further notice. Furthermore, I shall submit a Consumer Credit Act 1974 complaint to the OFT upon the basis that you have failed to comply with the OFT's direction of 5 April 2006 and are therefore not a 'fit and proper person' to hold a consumer credit licence under the 1974 Act. If you do not understand what this means then seek advice from your legal department. Yours faithfully,

Hello everyone, Many thanks for your replies. I will be sending the LBA letter to HSBC on monday as it will be the end of the 14 days. I tracked the letter via Royal main tracking and it was sent to HSBC on 04/09 so they would have received it the same day as Halifax does. Hmmm... should I send the LBA to Halifax as well?? Halifax did called me on 06/09 and verbally agreed to pay up after I sign a few documents which they will send to me before the 14 days, I have not heard from them eversince. Again 14 days ends on monday as well, still no sign of documents. How do I rephrase the LBA then since Halifax did call me in respond to my letter. Best regards, Natz