Hi I have been reading the comments regarding Welcome and the unlawful things that they do. I am surprised you have not issued court proceedings against them. The small claims process is rather simple. All their agreements are breach of the consumer credit act and many many agreements will fall foul as extortionate credit. I have taken on a few cases against them myself and they have settled all of them. I wont take any nonsense from them and neither should you. I noticed many of you made application under the Data Protection Act 1998 and they failed to respond despite sending the request by recorded delivery. Let the information Commissioner know even if you have to wait a year for a reply. I have to admit Welcome are the worst company I have ever dealt with. I won my case against the following companies:- HSBC BARCLAYS WELCOME on the forth case against them RBS I have been researching Consumer Credit Law for sometime and found the Consumer Credit Law is really complex and complicated. If anyone else wants to research consumer credit law, I would sure recommend the following books Civil Practice 2009 Enclopedia of Consumer Credit Law Volumes 1,2 Consumer Credit Law R M Goode Consumer Credit Legislation Consumer Sales Law Pleadings Without Tears The Civil Court Practice 2008 ( Green Book) Civil Litigation Case Preparation Legal Drafting Contract Law Ansons Law of Contract

The Shadow I was wondering having made the request under section 77/78 and failed to obtain a true copy of the agreement and also under section 7 DPA 1998 then surely if you stopped paying having made the above requests the creditor took you to court, the court would be concerned that there was none disclosure. wont they? Preaction disclosure does not apply to cases allocated to the small claims track ie (claims below £5,000). I known Judges to get angry for none disclosure which forms a part of the duty on the creditor. Courts are always keen to know the how the parties have behaved prior to proceedings.

Contract - Express & Implied Terms Contract: express and implied terms How are terms incorporated into a contract? At first it looks like a silly question, because we’d usually expect them to be explicitly included in the contract. Express terms are terms that have been specifically mentioned and agreed by both parties at the time the contract is made. They can either be oral or in writing. However, sometimes a term which has not been mentioned by either party will nonetheless be ‘included’ in the contract, often because the contract doesn’t make commercial sense without that term. Terms like this are called implied terms, and there are two main types: Terms implied by statute: the Sale of Goods Act 1979. The key provisions are: Section 12: the person selling the goods has to have the legal right to sell them. Section 13: if you’re selling goods by description, e.g. from a catalogue or newspaper advert, then the actual goods have to correspond to that description. Section 14: the goods must be of “satisfactory quality” – that is, they should meet the standard that a reasonable person would regard as “satisfactory”. Also, if the buyer says they’re buying the goods for a particular purpose, there’s an implied term that the goods are fit for that purpose. Section 15: if you’re selling the goods by sample – you show the customer one bag of flour and they order 50 bags – then the bulk order has to be of the same quality as the sample. Terms implied by the courts… As a matter of fact. Something that’s so obviously included that it didn’t need to be mentioned in the contract. If I agree to pay you £50 for a lawnmower, it probably wouldn’t occur to us to write down that we mean fifty pounds sterling, as opposed to any other sort of pound. That’s obvious to both of us. (Beware of this point – it has to have been obvious to both parties – it’s not enough to show that one party thought it was included, or that the contract would have been more reasonable with the added term.) As a matter of law. This is about general considerations of public policy – the courts are laying down, as a matter of law, how the parties to certain types of contract ought to behave. For example, in one case, the courts held that landlords of blocks of flats ought to keep the communal areas (lifts, stairs etc) in a reasonable state of repair – so that term was implied into the rental contract. Customary terms. Some terms are generally known to be included in contracts in a particular trade or locality. Amongst bakers, “one dozen” means thirteen – they don’t have to include terms in every contract specifying that. Do note that any of these terms implied by the courts can be excluded with an express term. If a bakers contract has a clear term in it that says “one dozen means twelve for the purposes of this contract”, then the courts can’t say that a dozen has to equal thirteen!

If you have recently acquired a motor vehicle under a hire purchase or conditional sale agreement, it may be regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 ('the 1974 Act'). The easiest way to find out is to dig-out your agreement and look in the top left hand corner. If it says "regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974" then your agreement is 'regulated'. If it does not say so but if you are an individual and your total amount of credit is less than £25,000 then the agreement should be regulated by the 1974 Act. If it doesn't say it is, then take advice as soon as possible! So, if your agreement is regulated by the 1974 Act what happens if you fall in to arrears? There are three options: the creditor (i.e the person who you make your payments to) can send you a default notice under section 87 of the 1974 Act; you can give written notice at any time before the 'expiry' of a default notice to terminate the agreement, return the motor vehicle and pay the difference between what you have paid and one half of the total amount payable under the agreement; or you can apply for a 'time order' under section 129 of the 1974 Act which, if your financial difficulties are short term, may give you more time to pay the instalments and stop the creditor from ending the agreement and recovering the motor vehicle Default Notices Section 87(1) of the 1974 Act allows the creditor to send you a default notice giving you fourteen days from the date you receive it to pay the arrears. The default notice must contain all of the necessary information under the Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983 ('the 1983 Regulations'), which includes a statement saying the notice is a default notice served under section 87(1) of the 1974 Act a description of the agreement the name and address of both the debtor and the creditor details of the breach (i.e. late payment) and, if the breach can be remedied, the date by which it must be remedied or, if the breach is not capable of remedy, the amount required to be paid after the expiry of the specified date; a statement saying: if the action required by this notice is taken before the date shown no further enforcement action will be taken in respect of that breach a statement saying: if you do not take the action required by this notice before the date shown then the further action set out below may be taken against you a clear and unambiguous statement saying that if the action is not taken by the date specified, what it will do (for example, if will it terminate the agreement and recovery possession of the motor vehicle) if the agreement is one of hire purchase or conditional sale, a statement saying: but if you have paid at least one third of the total amount payable under the agreement set out below (or any installation charge plus one third of the rest of the amount payable). The creditor may not take back the goods against your wishes unless he gets a court order. (In Scotland, he may need to get a court order at any time.) If he does take them back without your consent or a court order, you have the right to get back all of the money you have paid under the agreement set out below if an amount of money is required to be paid, the amount before deducting any rebate on early settlement statements saying: if you have difficulty in paying any sum owing under the agreement or taking any other action required by this notice, you can apply to the court which may make an order allowing you more time if you are not sure what to do, you should get help as soon as possible. For example you should contact a solicitor, your local trading standards department or your nearest citizens' advice bureau important - you should read this carefully Under Regulations 33 of the Consumer Credit (Information Requirements and Duration of Licenses and Charges) Regulations 2007 the default notice must from 1 October 2008 also include the following statement: You have the right to end this agreement at any time before the final payment falls due. Note that this right may be lost if you do not act before the date shown (after which we may take action). If the date for final payment has not passed and you wish to end this agreement, you should write to the person to whom you make your payments. You will need to pay £ if you wish to end this agreement by the date shown and we will be entitled to the return of the goods. You will also be liable for costs if you have not taken reasonable care of the goods. If the default notice fails to include all of the necessary information, it is likely to be ineffective and will not allow the creditor to recovery the motor vehicle unless you give your consent to the recovery. So, what can you do if it is recovered against your wishes? The answer depends on how much you have paid to the creditor. If you have paid more than one third of the total amount payable, section 90 of the 1974 Act states that the motor vehicle is 'protected' from repossession. So, if the motor vehicle is recovered then, under section 91 of the 1974 Act you are entitled to a return of all of the money you have paid to the creditor, regardless of how long you have had the motor vehicle. If you have paid less than one third of the total amount payable, the motor vehicle is not protected from repossession. Instead, if it is recovered you can say that the creditor has wrongfully interfered with your right to possession of the motor vehicle. The Court cleared-up what this meant in Chartered Trust plc v King (2001) WL 172107 and decided that the debtor (i.e. you) are entitled to a return of all of the money paid to the creditor. Again, it is irrelevant how long you have had the motor vehicle. Debtor's Termination Under section 99 of the 1974 Act a debtor under a hire purchase or conditional sale agreement can, at any time before the agreement has ended, give written notice to the creditor to end the agreement. Once the agreement has ended, you have to return to the motor vehicle in a reasonable condition and, if you have paid less than a half of the total amount payable, you must pay the creditor the difference between one half of the agreement and what you have paid. If you have paid more than one half, you only have to return the motor vehicle and pay the arrears at the date of your letter. It is important to remember that you can exercise your right under section 99 of the 1974 Act even if you have received a default notice as long as the date in that notice has not passed. In First Response Finance Limited v Donnelly [2006] GCCR 5901 the Court considered whether a debtor's termination after the date specified in the default notice would limit the amount payable to the creditor to the difference between one half of the agreement and what had been paid. It decided that it did not and the debtor was liable for the total amount payable under the agreement minus the amount paid by the debtor and the motor vehicle's net sale proceeds. Time Order Before you can apply to the Court for a time order, you must be served with a default notice or, when they become required by law, an arrears notice. Normally, the Court only has the power to give you extra time to pay the arrears but if the agreement is one of hire purchase or conditional sale, it can make an order under section 130(2) of the 1974 Act to effectively re-write the agreement. The Court will consider your financial position. It is therefore vital that you send to the Court and the creditor as much information as possible about your financial position and explain, with evidence, how it will get better. If there is little prospect of it doing so, the Court is unlikely after the decision in First National Bank plc v Syed [1991] 2 All ER 250 to give you extra time to pay. Summary If you run into financial difficulties under a regulated hire purchase or conditional sale agreement, the first question to ask is whether you want to keep the motor vehicle. If so, your only real option is to contact the creditor and negotiate a payment plan. If it is unwilling to do so, you can apply for a time order under section 129 of the 1974 Act if you receive a default notice or, in the future, if you receive an arrears letter. However, your application is unlikely to be successful if you cannot show your financial problems are temporary. If you do not want to keep the motor car then you should consider whether it would be cheaper to terminate the agreement under section 99 of the 1974 Act. If so, send your letter by recorded delivery to the creditor's registered office and make sure you keep a copy. Then try to negotiate a way to pay the balance outstanding (if anything).

Welcome Finance Finally accepted our claim for misselling PPI....... Their final response. Sent me your email address if u want copy

Dont trust them.. they are not the sort of company you can trust...

Since they cannot find the agreement the account becomes into dispute. Stop making payments and let them take action without it.....the court will laugh at them and throw the case out... this is what I think...

Just Something that you will find interesting Section 6: Statements to be provided in relation to fixed-sum credit agreements 23 Section 6 inserts a new section 77A after section 77 of the 1974 Act. Section 77A will require creditors in regulated fixed-sum credit agreements to provide debtors with annual statements in the specified form, the first of which is required within one year of the day after the date on which the agreement was made. 24. If a creditor does not give the debtor an annual statement when required to do so, then he is not entitled to enforce the agreement during the period of his noncompliance and the debtor is not liable to pay any interest during this period. The debtor is also not liable to pay any default sum (see note in respect of section 18 below) that would have become payable during the period of non-compliance or would have become payable after the end of that period in connection with a breach of the agreement occurring during that period. A creditor will not be required to give the debtor an annual statement if there are no further sums payable under the agreement.

I am currently drafting the particulars of claim if anyone would like to see the guide drop me a PM. Please note I will be able to send this to you after 17th of July when I am back at work.

To the people who sent me a PM regarding the breaches of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and Consumer Credit Act 2006. I still have alot more breaches to add to the list I sent you and will continue to add to the list.

Welcome Finance Agreements are in breach of the Consumer Credit 1974 and also Consumer Credit Act 2006. Anyone wants to see the listed breaches drop me a private message.

The Regulated Credit Agreement was not properly executed under section 61(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (‘the Act) in that:- a) Contrary to section 60(1)(b) the document did not embody all the terms of the agreement other then implied terms in that it excluded a term orally agreed between the parties whereby the creditor would effect insurance of the goods. b) Contrary to section 61(1) © when the document was presented to the debtor for signature it was not in such state that all of its terms were legible. c) Contrary to the Consumer (Credit Agreements) regulation 1983 (‘the Regulations) regulation 2 and schedule 1, Paragraph 1, the document did not contain any heading. d) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 1, paragraph 2 of the regulations, the document did not state the name or any address of the creditor or the name and address of the debtor. e) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 1, paragraph 3 of the regulations, the document did not contain any alternatives an adequate description of the goods. f) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 1 paragraph 4 of the regulations, the document did not state the cash price in respect of the goods. g) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 1 paragraph 5 of the regulations, the document did not state the amount of the advance payment to be made by the debtor. h) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 1 paragraph 9 of the regulations, the document did not state the total charge for credit. i) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 1 paragraph 11, of the regulations, the document did not show the total amount payable. j) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 1 paragraph 15, of the regulations, the document failed to state the APR. k) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 1 paragraph 18, of the regulations, the document did not contain a statement indicating that in which might occur under the agreement of the rate or amount of any item entering into that calculation. l) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 1 paragraph 21, of the regulations, the document contained no description of the security provided by the debtor. m) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 1 paragraph 22, of the regulations, the document contained no indication of any charges payable on default. n) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 2, paragraph 3 of the regulations, the document did not contain a statement in the prescribed form setting out the debtors’ right to cancel the agreement. o) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 2, paragraph 5, of the regulations, the document did not contain a paragraph in the prescribed form setting out the debtors rights of termination alternatively contained in the paragraph purporting to set out such rights which was not form the form prescribed by the regulations. p) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 2, paragraph 9 of the regulations, the document did not contain a statement in the prescribed for setting out the debtor’s rights in relation to repossession alternatively contained a statement concerning those rights which did not conform to the said paragraph. q) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 5, paragraph 1, of the regulations, the document did not contain any form of signature box which did not confirm to the requirements of that paragraph. r) Contrary to regulation 2 and schedule 5, paragraph 1, of the regulations, the creditor’s signature did not appear in the form of a signature box prescribed by that paragraph. s) Contrary to sections (58(1) and 61(2), the creditor failed to give the debtor a copy of the unexecuted agreement containing the prescribed notice and failed to give the debtor a copy of the document referred to in the unexecuted agreement, namely a blank bankers order. t) Contrary to section 61(2), the creditor sent the unexecuted agreement to the debtor less then seven days after sending the copy thereof under section 58(1). u) Contrary to section 61.(2), the agreement being one to which section 58(1) applied, during the consideration period, the creditor without receiving any request from the debtor, frequently communicated with the debtor both by telephoning him and by visiting his home. 4. By reason of sections 61 and 65 of the Act, therefore, the said purported agreement is not enforceable by the creditor against the debtor. The Regulated Credit Agreement was not properly executed under section 61.doc

test

test

test

edit

The old rules apply to agreements made prior to april 2007, therefore if PPI was not a condition for making the agreement then the agreement could be potentially unenforceable. Breaches in the execution of the Act. Anyone wants a good read I would strongly recommend the following large binders............ I purchased the following books Encyclopedia of Consumer Credit Law by A G Guest & M G Lloyd ( Sweet & Maxwell) Volume 1&2 Also Consumer Credit Legislation by Goode Volume 1,2,3 I have been researching the consumer credit act for a while now and I cannot believe the number of credit agreements which could be rendered as being unenforceable. I sometimes wonder why personal loans need to be on variable rates? is this because they increase the APR when someone dont pay up? mmmmm I wonder.

Andie, I have sent you a copy of the letter settling out claim for misselling PPI Insurance they have not paid up yet but will do when it is before the judge.

Hi Andie I would not take on the case if I was not confident...

I am going to take the cowboys to court now. No more silly games... they really now how to wind you up.. I know other people who will be issuing court proceedings also...

test

test

test

Their credit agreement states the following:- £10.00 if they have to call you I called them about 15 times in the space of 6 months £150.00 £10.00 if they have to write you I wrote to them 11 times £110.00 £20.00 if payment is returned unpaid Charge Daily interest on PPI £25.00 if they have to visit you I have not visited them so if I do I will charge them £25.00 and interest on interest. I would recommend anyone contacting either by phone or letter to charge the same, this would mean you have equal rights under the contract. These people do not communicate internally and pass you around department to department. They do not update their systems .. Always ask them for a copy of the recording if the call is recorded.

It somes makes me wonder why the Banks need to have variable rates???? The payers pay for the banks cock ups?