My father-in-law owns a factory premises, which he rents out to a business. Recently there has been a problem when the business owner paid the rent (£3000) by cheque into my father-in-laws account. The cheque was dishonoured, re-presented, and dishonoured again. Both my FiL and the business owner were out of the country, one in Asia and one in the Far East. They spoke on the phone, and my FiL threatened to close the factory unless the rent was paid. Both had to come back to the UK to sort it out. When they returned, it was discovered that the business owner's bank had debited the money from his account, but my FiL's bank (Lloyd's) hadn't credited it. Lloyd's have admitted that it was their fault, and have promised to credit the money within 5 days. All well and good, but both parties have incurred considerable expense in having to fly back to the UK, interrupting their business trips, and my FiL has incurred several instances of bank charges due to his own cheques bouncing as a result of the mistake. It's good that the mistake itself appears to have been sorted, but can they claim any compensation for their other losses from the bank? And if so, how? Many thanks.

Yes, we tried that: they told us that once a GP has decided not to "take" you, for whatever reason, that's it, there's nothing they can do... doesn't seem like much of a "service" to me... the only thing they were able to suggest was try some other GP's several miles away and hope one of them would take them on. But as I said, mobility is a problem.

This is on behalf of my elderly mother-in-law, who is diabetic and finds it difficult to walk. She lives with her elderly brother, who has mental health issues and is incapable of looking after himself. Both require a regular supply of various drugs for their respective conditions. Last week my mother-in-law left her usual GP's practice (taking her brother with her), as she was fed up with the poor service he has given both her and her brother: he consistently fails to obtain results of blood tests, or loses them, forcing her to retake them, which involves an uncomfortable and difficult trip to the nearest hospital. As her brother cannot be left alone, he has to accompany her. This has happened so many times, she has finally lost patience (no pun intended!). However, when she tried to register with another local GP, she was told that the local boundaries have changed, and that they cannot take her because they no longer take people with her postcode. This is despite the fact that her daughter-in-law who lives at the same address is registered with this GP! She then tried the only other local GP, who refused to take her due to the fact that her son, when he was a wild youth over 10 years ago, once tried to fake an illness and obtain some drugs by deception (This was a one-off occurrence: he's now a responsible adult with his own business). In desperation, my mother-in-law was forced to go back to her original GP and ask to be re-registered, but he has refused to take her back. She is now in the desperate condition of not having any GP at all, and both her and her brother need their medication urgently. Where does she stand? How can the NHS allow two vulnerable people to fall through the net like this? Is it allowed, or is there some law that can force a GP to take her and her brother onto their register? Please, has anyone got any advice? Many thanks.

Write everything down exactly as it happened: then send it as a letter of complaint to your council, adding that you had to take time off work, get a babysitter etc. It won't help the council resolve the issue (they'll just deny it was their fault, of course), but it will get logged and your letter will then form part of the evidence in your defence at the tribunal. In my experience, the more evidence that you show of the council's incompetence, the more sympathetic a tribunal will be.

Thanks. I can see we're going to have to try and work through this, rather than moving out. In fact, just yesterday, I got a sniff of a potential job, which would greatly ease our situation (more money, me out of the house for the day etc), so here's hoping!

I recently won a tribunal for the overpayment of HB, not as much as you, only £1500. But it was solely due to the council's incompetence, getting facts totally wrong, making assumptions etc. My advice would be to fight every step of the way: if you've genuinely done nothing wrong you will find the tribunals service to be very helpful and sympathetic. My council didn't even turn up for my hearing!

That's very useful indeed, many thanks. So, I looked up my LHA here, and it seems my local council will pay £260 (I presume this is for a weekly rent) for a 2 bedroomed property, and £200 for a 1 bedroomed property. Now, as I am in a 2 bedroomed, if they pay up to £260, that will be more than enough to cover my full rent, which will mean I won't have to move out. But, will they then insist that as I only "need" one bedroom, they will only pay up to £200 per week? This would mean that I don't get enough to pay my full rent, and would force me to move.

Yes, I think I'll have to give them a call, as a last resort. I was hoping I could find out elsewhere before calling them though: I didn't particularly want to alert them to a potential change in our situation before we've decided what to do: past experience has taught me that they tend to suspend benefits while they investigate potential changes in circumstances, and we can't risk this happening!

Yes, first place I looked before coming here:) No definite info there. There is an esitmated benefits calculator, but as it only asks for a few details, it's only a rough estimate, so while it may give an indication, it still could be wildly off. There are no actual figures enabling you to work it out yourself...

Wow, well done for sorting that out! I'm impressed, but it's no more than your parents deserve. It's disgusting the depths to which this penny-pinching will sink, ignoring the real effects it has on people's lives... I just tried to look up the Local Housing Allowance rates on the DWP website, only to find that they're not actually given! How dumb is that? It's beginning to look like they don't actually want you to know: the less you know, the less you can fight back...

Thanks for your reply. How do I do that: ask the council? There's no information regarding the actual rates in any of the documentation relating to our claim...

Can anyone else add to or confirm what's been said above? An ideal outcome for us would be if I could stay where I am, and my wife rented somewhere nearby, so that we could have some space away from each other and work on rebuilding our relationship....

Ah, I see... so what could conceivably happen is that if one person moves out, the amount of HB they pay goes down accordingly by whatever amount they calculate. This would then, in effect, force me to move out, as I wouldn't be able to afford to pay the shortfall myself... is this correct?

My wife and I live in a two bedroom flat, rented from a private landlord, where the rent is paid for by Housing Benefit. Both of us are jobless, although we are both attempting to start our own businesses, using the second bedroom as an office. Because we're under each other's feet all day, together with our low income, and associated stress levels, this has led to friction between us, and we are considering a trial separation. My wife has expressed the desire to move out and rent somewhere else. What I need to know is, would the council then say to me: "We're not prepared to pay HB for a 2 bedroom flat when only one person is living there: you will have to move to a 1 bedroom flat yourself". It's bad enough that we've got to this point anyway, but if I have to move as well it would be even more hassle and stress, and would undermine my fledgling business as it's registered to this address. I'd really like to stay where I am.

Hi, thanks for your response. I was more or less co-erced into getting the HSBC accounts: I was part of a New Deal scheme aimed at getting people off benefits and into being self-employed, and part of the package involved getting a business bank account. The recommended bank was HSBC, presumably because the scheme had some sort of arrangement with them. The other accounts are there as parachute accounts. I take on board your suggestions about trying to deal with them on a personal level: I'll certainly give it a try, although my actual branch is many miles away from where I currently live, and getting hold of them on the phone is well-nigh impossible: I'm far more often likely to end up talking to a call-centre in India! I currently have a stayed claim for over £4000 in charges against NatWest, dating back to Summer 2007, just prior to the OFT case being launched: annoying, because if that claim had gone through, I wouldn't be in this mess now:) I'll try the personal approach, and if that doesn't work, I guess it's time to start another claim: after all, why not? Many thanks for your help!

Hi everyone, After a couple of years unemployment due to redundancy, I am finally, slowly, getting my life back on track, slowly clearing debts, and trying to build a small business of my own. I have a basic bank account with Barclays, which I use solely for the rent, to keep it separate from any problems elsewhere. I have a current account at Lloyds, for day to day use. I have a current account and a business account with HSBC. Due to the recent downturn in the economy, my business is slow to stationary, and I am not actually making any money at all at the moment, although the business is a sound idea and I have high hopes for the future, if I can just get over the last few hurdles. Currently I am living only on Working Tax Credit and Housing Benefit, which works out as less per month than I would get from Job Seeker's Allowance, but has the benefit that I am free to earn money from my business without it being penalised by loss of benefits. Anyway, i am currently overdrawn in both my HSBC accounts, both unarranged overdrafts. This isn't due to unnecessary spending, just my direct debits for things like fuel, broadband, water rates, phone bills etc. However, HSBC is charging me astronomical sums, almost pound for pound: From being £157 overdrawn, I find myself owing them £243, that's £86 in charges! I appreciate and accept the principle that if I have an unarranged overdraft then I pay a charge for doing so; but a reasonable charge would be something in the region of £20-£30, not almost as much again. As you can appreciate, trying to clear debts when on such a low income is difficult, almost impossible when the banks keep moving the goalposts like this. On top of this, they've cancelled my cards, which I find a bit heavy handed, as a) I wasn't actually using them, and b) it's not like I owe them thousands: the amount I actually owe them is laughably small compared to many other people. What's my best course of action here? Ideally, I'd prefer not to pay these charges, but will they listen if I simply ask them to drop it? Or can I force them to decrease the amount in any way? Many thanks for any help.

I experienced the same thing, up to 9 or 10 calls a day. I countered by asking them to prove it really was HSBC: after all, it was someone clearly calling from abroad, who couldn't pronounce my name correctly (which I would expect my genuine bank to know), and asking for personal details. Naturally, they couldn't prove they were actually HSBC, even though I assume they were. I told them I refused to give out personal details over the phone: after several times of me saying this, the calls stopped. Now I just get 3 letters a week, LOL.

We'll see what our finances are like when they actually ask. To be honest, I'd prefer, if circumstances allow, to pay it back as soon as I can just to be done with it and not have to deal with them again. Thanks again for all your help, and best wishes for 2009.

As the money wasn't actually yours it shouldn't be classified as a change in your circumstances; your bank account was just being used as a cashing facility. I assume from what you've said that your boyfriend doesn't live with you? If he did, then that would be classified as a change, but as he doesn't, it should be OK.

Hi, As long as you've got documentary evidence that the money wasn't yours (i.e. for doing some work you hadn't told the council about), then you should be fine. If the payment was through the Official Receivers, then your boyfriend should have all the necessary paperwork.

Is that £3.50 per week?

Just thought I'd post an update to this. I hope it helps and encourages anyone else with similar problems. Filing an official complaint didn't work: the council (obviously) found itself not at fault in any way. After many further letters going back and forth, a Tribunal date was set for 9th of Jan 2009. The Tribunal service had difficulty obtaining my records of my JSA claim from the DWP, as the council had given them a wrong National Insurance number for me, which led to further delays and exasperation. To cut a long story short, I attended the Tribunal yesterday. The council (despite being only across the road) didn't even bother sending anyone. The Tribunal found the council at fault, and ruled that the majority of the overpayment of £1500 was not recoverable. They ruled however that the final payment we received of £300 was recoverable, as it was at that point we realised that something was amiss and contacted the council. I now await the council's response and suggestions for repayment. I'm very pleased; the Tribunal judge was very nice and fair, the whole experience was not in any way intimidating, and I was not made to feel like a criminal on trial. And we get to keep £1200 in HB that the council overpayed us. Thanks are due to everyone who offered advice on this thread: it was a great help. I sincerely hope that's the end of it, and I can now return to normality:)

I have today already written to them, saying: "Thank you for your letter of 08/09/08, with enclosures. Initially, I welcomed the opportunity of going to a Tribunal, so that we may finally get this matter resolved once and for all. It has, after all, been over a year since we moved from Sutton. However, I have mentioned previously of my attempts to obtain a letter from Makerfield JobCentre Plus in Wigan, that confirms the date they informed you of my move: despite at least four separate requests, they have continually failed to provide me with the letter. Today I contacted them again, and explained the situation. This time they informed me that you cannot take this matter to a Tribunal at this present time, as you are not following the correct procedure. Apparently, you need to make an access request via the Housing Benefit Liaison Officers, in order that my files can be recovered from the archives. As they were clerical files (which you should have known) they are not viewable on the RATS system. Once you have done this, you will be able to see the exact date that Makerfield informed you that I had moved, which, taken in conjunction with my letter of 24/08/07, clearly demonstrates that the Council is in error. Please confirm immediately that the planned Tribunal has been either postponed or cancelled, as I’m told it cannot take place until the required information is obtained according to the correct procedure. Please contact Makerfield JobCentre Plus for confirmation." I will also follow your advice and make an Official Complaint; time to go on the offensive, I think.

Your claim will be for contribution-based JSA initially. Think of it as like a points system; when your points are used up (i.e. your contributions run out), you will no longer be eligible for contribution-based JSA, but will be eligible for income-based JSA.

I've now spoken to the JobCentre in Wigan. They have informed me that, in order to get my file out of the archive, a request has to be made via the Housing Benefit Liaison officer at my old council, to the HB Liaison Officer at the JobCentre. They informed me that because this hasn't been done, my council are following "incorrect procedure", and that the Tribunal process shouldn't go ahead. Anybody got anything to comment on this? I have no idea what should, or shouldn't be happening....