Same here, three years and then I had a statement and a letter about three months ago. Can't wait to see which DCA gets in touch this time - there can't be that many left...

Hi Shotters I've actually missed a couple of phone calls from the HL Solicitors who have been trying to reach me. Interesting, I'll wait and see what comes next. Keep you posted. LL x

Hi Andy Filed today and printed for my records. Many, many thanks. LL

Andy, this is incredibly helpful. You've encapsulated everything perfectly as usual. Really, really grateful. I'll file my defence in the morning and see what comes back... Enjoy the rest of your weekend LL x

Many thanks for this, just reading through Andy's suggested defence to see how to approach this...

Thank you, Andy. I had misread the amount claimed as DN monies, not interest. I have done CCA, but not CPR or SAR. As proceedings have now started, should I issue CPR 31.14 request? Split claims are new to me, but can see how they're seen as an abuse of process. Learning every day... Thank you for your help, LL

Hi Brig, thanks for this info. To get to AQ stage, I still have to file a defence don't I? I imagine even a 'loose' defence that touches on the strange calculation of figures, dubious DN, etc could enable this to proceed to this stage. However, because this has been passed to a third party, I wondered if it would be easier/quicker to go direct to them as I'm sure they'd like my monthly payment. I'm not sure I'd get away with £5 a month for many years though, that appeals, but I guess they have to agree to mediation in the first instance. Looking forward to further advice on this. LL

Thank you both. The total o/s to HSBC, now sold to Sigma SPV, is around £2500. I'm happy to discuss with them to avoid CCJ etc and associated stress, but will have to do so with Sigma not HSBC... Will await your advice. LL

A little nudge on this as tomorrow is the last working day I have before my defence is due. I could get on the phone and start a dialogue with the OP if a defence is likely to fail. Thanks again, LL

The POC is a little erroneous. I wonder if the claim is designed to prompt a payment that will settle a precedent for a further claim for the full amount? If this is the case and the CCA is indeed valid following GG's comments above about the signature (my reason for the dispute), I wonder if I should contact the OP and see if a payment arrangement can be agreed on before this results in a very unwanted CCJ. Thanks for you advice, as always, LL

Thank you all for your help: I do think there is a discrepancy on the document, in view of the timescale, I think I should point this out on my defence, although I note the comment from GG: The signature that isn't mine is beneath the Optional Cardholder Repayment Protector in the 'Signature of Customer' box. This is spurious surely? As for the DN, I'm sure I haven't received another one, also their claim is for "Part only of monies due under regulated CCA no..." I believe this is the crux of my defence in that their POC focuses on the DN and agreement not being complied with. The DN is dated 4 July 2008 and payment to remedy the breach was demanded by 18 July 2008. You're right, no posting time allowance. I spoke to HSBC on receipt of the DN and they told me the payment could be collected from my HSBC current account on 1st August. It was and was received by them on 4th August. So, I didn't actually make the payment in time to remedy the DN, although if the DN is faulty, it helps. The claim form is dated 10 April, it was issued at Northampton so can be responded to online. The claimant is Sigma SPV 1 Ltd and I have a letter from HSBC confirming this debt was assigned. All documents were sent to my old address (I moved recently). I am very sure that I would have kept any subsequent DN as I've made a habit of not throwing such paperwork away. It'll be interesting to see what their claim documents throw up; if another DN was issued but not received, I wonder if it will also be invalid on the posting allowance issue... Thank you all again, do you think the faulty DN should form the basis of my defence? LL The Claim is

Thank you both for your help. Brig, yes there's a link to the CCA on my first post. Re the DN. It was dated 4 July to be paid by 18 July. I was told by HSBC the £301 would be collected from my account on 1st August, which it was. The summons is for £2 less (£299 plus costs etc) than the DN value requested. I cannot recall receiving another DN, but can't rule it out 100%. Havinastella, the last payment made on this account was on 14 Jan 09 (£31), which was the amount requested by HSBC as an initial payment when they wrote to me to tell me my account would be passed to their agent (DG Solicitors). Hope this helps. Thank you both again. LL

Hi, hope you can help. DCA (Sigma) has issued a summons against me, the debt from an HSBC Gold Card having been sold to them. Brief history: - 4/7/08 Default notice received on (the amount in question I believe was paid from my HSBC current account on 1/8/08. - 24/10/08 sent CCCS standard letter offering £1 per month due to financial problems. - 4/11/08 A letter received saying my proposals for repayment were not accepted. - 19/11/08 HSBC letter passing admin to their agent for repayment arrangement admin. - 29/1/09 Requested copy of credit agreement. - 20/2/09 Sent 'Default under the CCA 1974 failure to produce agreement' letter to HSBC. - 26/2/09 Received copy of agreement and T&Cs. However, HSBC CCA.pdf as I hope you can see on the attached two pages the two 'customer signatures' are different. The one below the Optional Cardholder Repayment Protector box is not mine at all. - From this point onwards I continued to receive DCA demands from multiple DCAs (7 or 8). - 12/7/10 Sent Account in Dispute letter to Moorcroft, with a copy to HSBC (extract: This account is in dispute with HSBC Bank plc and has been since November 2008. Not only is this a breach of the Consumer Protection From Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 in line with the Office Of Fair Trading's debt collection guidelines, but also in breach of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and Data Protection Act 1998. My previous dispute from November 2008 has NOT been answered. As HSBC Bank plc is now in default of my Consumer Credit Act agreement request and have also breached *s10 Data Protection Act request , I consider this account to be in SERIOUS DISPUTE.) - Until now, sent the same Account in Dispute letter to the various DCAs, and then I receive a Summons... The POC state: I am hoping that my paper trail is complete, but cannot be 100% certain. However, have the following questions: 1. The only DN I hold was paid as itemised above. I do not hold another. 2. Surely the CCA is invalid if it contains a third party signature where mine should appear? I have repeatedly told (on the phone) HSBC when they've chased me that I am still waiting for a CCA with only my signature on it, they've ignored these requests and simply passed it around DCAs. 3. If the account is in dispute (see my letter above), surely they cannot take action against me? I would appreciate any help you can give me with regard to my defence that I need to file. I received the summons late as I've moved house, but it needs to be back by 15/5/12. I sent the Acknowledgement of Service back in good time. If I've left anything out, please let me know. Many many thanks, LL

Hi, update after today's hearing. Not good news unfortunately. The OP solicitor turned up late, but was indeed there. We had a different DJ, who had read the file and asked both sides to put their cases. She told me that my application to strike out was based on CPR 3.42 paras A and B, i.e. no grounds for claim and an abuse of the court's process. I put my case as well as I could and obviously so did the OP. I explained that the documents were received very late and I hadn't had an opportunity to discuss them with my ex yet, but they certainly did not represent what I'd asked for. There were no copy invoices or correspondence as requested repeatedly. I also made a comment about no contract being included, the OP quickly interjected and said there was. What I have for three children are two 'Applications for Admission' and one 'Acceptance Form' with conditions on the reverse (see attachments above). I will copy these, remove personal info and post up the fronts tomorrow morning. In any event, the DJ said that because the OP had submitted a witness statement and 'some documents' that showed invoice and payment information, albeit not the actual documents, no correspondence etc, there was evidence that transactions had taken place so that left room for a claim. My abuse of process point was well received and I was praised for my patience and continued efforts to get evidence to get the claim moving forward. However, she listened to the excuses and apologies from the OP and concluded that the claim had gone on for way too long without a result and that was partly due to the case not being allocated to track, no directions etc. So, my application was dismissed and the case will be allocated to fast track for trial, there will be directions for disclosure of further information and she will push for the matter to be processed quickly. The OP have been allowed to submit an amended PoC and will do so within 28 days and then I can file a detailed defence etc. The OP said today they would be no claim for costs. I didn't think to ask if that was for the matter to date or in the future, must assume it applies to activities up until now. When we left the room, we spoke to the solicitor for the school who said the school would be pursuing the matter and to submit an offer to her. I explained that it was hard given the documents we have, or don't have but she said to go through and come up with something in writing by way of an offer. I'd be interested to see what you think of the 'contracts' I'm going to post, but it may be that we come up with an offer and an arrangement to pay what we both feel is fair. Throughout this case, I haven't wanted to avoid payment completely, but to come to a settlement that reflects the appalling treatment of my son, the school's incredibly lax admin procedures and their poor conduct and zero response during these proceedings. I have a feeling that if the documents I have represent a form of contract and they come up with all the copy invoices and correspondence, it could be a more costly exercise at the end. But anything I can use to negotiate with is obviously going to be very helpful. I'll post up the 'contract' front pages in the morning and the Order when it comes through. For now, thanks again so much for all your invaluable advice, be interesting to see where we go now. More tomorrow, LL x

Quick update before the hearing at 2pm today. Contact the OP and asked if they were interested in adjourning for a couple of months or so to give us time to respond to their witness statement and dox. They've declined having taken advice from the school, so the apple hearing to strike out is going ahead at 2pm. Will update then.

And as proper attachments... Witness Statement 2 pages.pdf

Witness Statement 2 pages.pdf Oh dear, I hope these PDFs are readable?

Thanks Andy, I've today received this from the court (dated 8th Feb 2012 so before yesterday's witness statement) "It is ordered that: The hearing in this case scheduled for 20th Feb in this matter is to go ahead unless the parties consent to adjourn." Seems as though the DJ is hoping we'll still work it out... In the meantime, the bundle from the solicitor includes: Witness Statement outlining the excuses for the delays, copy attached (minus first intro point), copies of their correspondence, a very basic statement (one section itemising school year and amount due and another itemising the amounts paid), but no invoice copies or invoice numbers are included. Also attached are two Application for Admission forms for children 1 and 3, which are signed by us as parents under the following line: "We wish to apply to enter the child named above to X School. We agree that our child will be bound by the School Regulations as specified by the Headmaster. We accept the Conditions of Admission as stated overleaf." For some reasons Child 2 has a form with the same Conditions on the reverse but the front is titled Acceptance Form and just has a statement about enclosing deposit, non-returnable, and accepting the standard fees which will come into effect on entry. I've attached PDF images of the Conditions which are on the reverse of these documents and include a point about interest. The DJ did say he wasn't happy about interest being charged in relation to the constant delays at the last hearing. Does this help at all? When I received the letter from the Court today, I assumed the DJ had received the Witness Statement and was asking us to get back together to avoid more costs etc, but the order is dated before yesterday's statements from the solicitor. I don't want to go through the process starting again with new PoC, so was tempted to get in touch with the OP and ask for 3 months' adjournment to give us time to respond to their documents and come to an arrangement (a couple of invoice amounts shouldn't even be there, but guess that's where the negotiation starts). That was before I read your post... I'm also conscious we still don't have invoices, but is that being too picky? Would love to know what's going on inside the DJ's mind now that he's got their response pack. The hearing is Monday at 2pm, so if we're to adjourn I need to contact them tomorrow I imagine. What's your gut feeling Andy? LL SMC.pdf

Update in advance of the Application hearing on Monday: I have today received Witness Statement from the school's solicitor. They haven't included itemised invoices, but have found some statements and a signed contract In essence they're asking for this: "Accordingly, I respectfully request that the Def's Appn be dismissed and that directions be given for the future conduct of the proceedings, such directions to include service of a fully and properly pleaded POC together with interest calculation to which the Defendants can then respond' They've given lots of reasons why they didn't respond before (change of school staff etc), but I'm assuming the DJ will dismiss our Appln now. What I don't want is another POC and more costs after all this. If my application is dismissed, I'm back to asking for time to properly respond to the evidence and the opportunity to mediate and come to an arrangement to settle out of court, which is what the OP solicitors had agreed to at the last hearing. It's so frustrating that, yet again, they've responded at the last minute to a court date. Any advice, or should I just go in and simply re-plead my case on the grounds of the way this matter has been handled from the start? Thank you, LL

Application etc done and filed with a letter saying the OPs behaviour was vexatious, unprofessional and somewhat deceptive, considering they'd had 3 months to communicate in any form and yet still left it until the last day to delay things further. Fingers crossed. Thanks for all your help. LL

I've had a think about this and I still think I should make the application. I'm going to add a letter in response to the OP's emailed letter today saying this is yet another delaying tactic, in almost a year, the claimant has failed to produce any evidence to substantiate their claim, etc... How does that sound?!

Hi Andy Sod's Law, received this by email today: "We refer to the Order made by District Judge SX dated 17 October 2011. We confirm that it remains the parties’ intention to progress the matter towards a better understanding of each other’s case and to seek ultimately a negotiated resolution. Following the last hearing on 17 October 2011, during discussions between this firm’s representative and Mr and Mrs X, it was agreed that the progression of this matter could best be served by a clear understanding of the debt the College was seeking to recover and also the calculation of interest on same under the College’s terms and conditions. Unfortunately, there has been a change in personnel at the College and that has resulted in a delay in the production of the figures and calculation on interest. We anticipate that the figures and calculations can be finalised and forwarded to the Defendants and hopefully significant progress can be made in without prejudice discussions with a view to settlement within the next 28 days. We would, in the circumstances, appreciate a further 28 day stay of these proceedings. We would be grateful if this letter could be referred to the District Judge for a further stay to be ordered in the absence of the parties. You will note that we are copying this letter to both Mr and Mrs X." I wonder if the DJ will have had enough of these constant delays and if it's worth still going ahead with the Application to S/O. What do you think? LL

OK, I ticked the 'hearing' box so I'll make that known on Friday. When you say 'serve on notice to the claimant' is this something the court will do (I've done all the copies), or should I send them a copy of everything in my bundle (N244, letter, draft order and copies of docs referred to)? I thought the court sent it out.

Hi Andy Thank you so much for this, all really helpful. I took everything along to the court but the clerk advised me to come back and file the application, at the earliest, on Friday afternoon to give the OS time to come up with some information. I told her there wouldn't be enough time, virtually from this point, to come to an agreement with the OS, but she had said the DJ would see the application today and would more than likely leave it until Friday in any event. Also, she was only going to charge me £45; I thought the N244 fee had been £80 for years? Thanks again, LL

Excellent, thanks Andy.