Brilliant, that's reassuring.  Off to the Hermes forum now.

My daughter has been selling unwanted items, mostly clothes, for a couple of years now with no problems until recently. 

She sold to someone in Germany before Christmas, which was claimed never got there, so obviously paypal refunded the buyer, no questions, despite her never having any problems before now, which left a negative balance.  She sent it using Hermes, something I have only just realised was a big mistake.  She has proof of postage given to her when the package was collected, although the reference number is now not recognised by Hermes, so getting in touch with them to find out what happened to her parcel is impossible (as many social media platforms have confirmed this).

the outcome is that while we were trying to get in touch with Hermes, paypal have, very quickly, passed this on to Moorcroft who are now hassling her.  I have told her not to worry about Moorcroft as everyone knows how these people operate, I have reassured her that there will be no visit to the door from anyone.

The only concern she has is whether it will affect her credit file, as she has worked hard to get a good credit rating over the last 4 years and doesn't want something like this to destroy it.  My thought is that it can't as it is not credit, and she hasn't gained financially in any way, quite the opposite really, so it can't have any negative impact on her credit file?  She is prepared to give Moorcrost the money just to get it sorted, but I don't want her to be hasty in giving them people anything.

I've looked at a few posts similar to this and my understanding is that this is correct but just need reassurance to pass on to her.

Thank you

General form of judgment 

I've had the notification letter from the court but no payment details, do I pay the court or the claimant?

Hi Andy 

just wondering about what happens now, when do I pay and when will the ccj show, am I right in thinking that the ccj goes on and then you apply to get it removed once payment has been made 

thanks

Perfect, so I pay, avoid the ccj, then appeal later if I can prove the account was not mine, nothing to lose really except the fee to appeal

1 hour ago, Andyorch said:

No time actually stated in the regs...but making an appeal now within the 21 days is far less complicated and takes quite a while to process so gather your information...you can always drop the appeal if you research turns out pointless 

But I still need to pay in full within a month in the meantime to avoid the ccj?

Ok thanks,

so I pay it to avoid the ccj, then I gather more info about the rogue account number, so how long do I have to appeal out of time?

Sorry to keep going on about this, but I am trying to get more information from Yorkshire bank about the account number that wasn’t mine and still thinking about appealing depending on what they come back with.

if i do appeal, does the ccj then get put on hold until the outcome of the appeal, then the month to pay timer starts again.

The most important thing to me is to avoid the ccj being entered as that can’t happen under any circumstances  

So for example, I pay it in full, then manage to prove beyond doubt that the account wasn’t mine, say 2 years later, can I appeal then or is there a time limit. Just trying to think of possible options later

OK fair enough, probably won't bother.  Out of interest how long do you have to appeal?

So, if I pay within a month, the CCJ won't appear on my credit file, is this correct?

And, can you negotiate a lesser amount as full and final settlement and not have the CCJ registered, or is the amount final and non-negotiable?  

Thanks

So even if the Yorkshire can confirm that the account number that they claimed against was never mine, you still think it would be a waste of time appealing.

She was obviously on good terms with their solicitor, I must have just been unlucky on the day to get her, she clearly had no time for us.

It's difficult to expand without showing you the documents involved in full, as I have to remove any identifiers and the fine detail, so if there is any private section of this forum were you can view the full documents, I am happy to upload them.

However the main points that I got from this experience were.

1. It wasn't as relaxed and informal as I expected, which threw me into panic mode straight away.

2. The judge and solicitor used a lot of legal terms, and to be honest I was out of my depth, and should have maybe had a legal rep myself.

3. She dismissed the fact that the account number on all the letters from them was different to the account number on my statements, because I hadn't mentioned it before the hearing, I just noticed it myself the day before, and said she believed that the 2 account numbers were from the same account.

4. She was more interested in grilling me as to why I had left the overdraft at the time unpaid, then put me under oath to swear that I never made those payments, and threatened me with contempt of court if I lied.

5. She wouldn't let me answer on my wife's behalf and grilled her, she didn't know what to say as I had been sorting this out, so she agreed to the default judgement, and never wanted to be there in the first place, she was obviously distressed, judge never questioned us or solicitor about the letters being sent to her to a previous address.

6. So both defences were struck out and both given CCJ's, so ordered to pay the full amount (which will go to a debt collector, which annoys me more, I'd rather give it Yorkshire Bank) and costs of £1500.

I knew within minutes of the hearing that it wasn't going to go our way.

In hindsight I would have researched more and prepared more, but it's the first time I have been in that situation, and thought the judge would have been more sympathetic, but you learn by experience.

I plan to appeal as I believe I was stitched up, but I also will pay to avoid a CCJ, I don't need being lumbered with that for 6 years, and I will seek legal advice and be more prepared.  I have sent Yorkshire a SAR to see if they come up with anymore information, but I don't know if they will still have anything 13 years since the account was closed.

Thank you for all your help on this forum, it's invaluable.

Maybe but I have put so much on here I don’t know for sure.  I’ll put them on later.  I still find it unbelievable that the wrong account number was not considered 

They are all in it together, the judge and solicitor spoke as if they were best friends before the hearing, and to me as if I was something she stood in.

Not exactly surprised, no faith in the justice system 

Is that the end of it, is there nothing now I can do

Lost, can’t believe it, judge ignored the different account numbers as I hadn’t mentioned it previously and ignored all my evidence, gutted wasn’t expecting that.

so now what, I guess it’s a ccj

Andy 

just noticed while preparing what I’m going to say tomorrow that the account number they are claiming on is the incorrect one, so doesn’t match the bank statements they sent, I don’t know how I missed it but does that leave their argument worthless, even though I haven’t mentioned it in any statements

Every letter they have sent and the account number they referenced in their statements are wrong.

Got another letter from them on Friday with a counter argument to my witness statement and a revised (increased) charges sheet, I’ll not bother uploading it.

So am I right in thinking that the judge will have read all the evidence beforehand and will have a good idea of what the outcome will be

So Wednesday's the day.  The closer it's getting, the more nervous I'm starting to feel.  Although I sort of know what to expect, is there anything I should know or do to prepare?

What exactly do I need to do during the hearing? 

Thanks

HI

Received this on Friday, after submitted statement to court and to shoosmiths, which they received today, so I'm not sure what they are trying to prove now.  I'm guessing it's just another frightener, to highlight how much more it will cost me.  Any thoughts?

Thanks

costs.pdf

Thanks sent today

On 24/06/2019 at 13:04, Andyorch said:

Witness Statement Overdraft.pdf 291.26 kB · 4 downloads

Hi Andy 

taking this to the court today, do I need to send a copy to the claimant

thanks

Hi Andy,

Brilliant, thank you for this, it's really appreciated.  I'll submit this to the court this week.  Then just sit and wait until the 10th for the hearing.  I might have a few more questions nearer the time, about the process, but I'll have a break from this for a few days.

Thanks again

Thanks so much for your help and others who have offered advice 

Hi Andy

Can you please have a look at the latest attempt and hopefully it is almost there, it needs to be submitted soon.

Thank you

Response_update.pdf